My feeble attempt at the explanation of Christianity., You ask questions, and I'll try to answer. Rating Options

[NoSex]

Uhm, the last few pages here are a myriad of inaccuracies, falsities, misrepresentations, and lies. It's actually quite embarrassing. I haven't seen anything this bad since my extended involvement in the "Evolution Vs. Creationism" thread. Just to straighten a few things out:

1. Christianity has within its theology not a single original or unheard moral message. Far from teaching the world non-violence, Christianity was born out of quite possibly the most violent and war ridden religious practices of the world - that of Judaism. On the contrary: Hinduism, the world's oldest religion, was wholly pacifistic. This was a religion which promoted non-violence as a dogmatic tenant (Ahimsa). Buddhism would later follow in these pacifistic practices spawning, later, the religion of Jainism. While Jainists were using brooms to sweep the ground in front of their steps in order not to even kill a single insect, Jews were conquering the holy land and forcing heretics from their homes with swords and shields - all under the name of their holy God. This pacifism of Hinduism traces back 5,000 years before the onset of Christianity.

2. Common Law, which largely built the judicial system we understand in America and all of western society today, was introduced in England over a century before Christianity. The foundations of our (America's) most sacred (har har) governmental tenants, doctrines, and manifestos are of a secular nature, based mainly on the philosophies of the great empiricists John Locke (Locke's theory of "tabula rasa" provided for the "all men created equal" clause - it was against current Christian theology which promoted original sin.) and David Hume (who was an atheist, by the way) and the British Common Law. Thomas Paine and Jefferson, both well spoken despisers of Christianity, are seen as some of our most important founding fathers and brothers. In a letter (1814) to Thomas Cooper, Jefferson wrote, "For we know that the common law is that system of law which was introduced by the Saxons on their settlement in England, and altered from time to time by proper legislative authority from that time to the date of Magna Charta, which terminates the period of the common law. . . This settlement took place about the middle of the fifth century. But Christianity was not introduced till the seventh century; the conversion of the first christian king of the Heptarchy having taken place about the year 598, and that of the last about 686. Here then, was a space of two hundred years, during which the common law was in existence, and Christianity no part of it."

3. Socrates, Plato, and Aristotle all predate Christianity by several centuries.
Funny enough, it's commonly understood that these Greek writers influenced Christian thought and theology, not the other way around. In fact, referring back to our first point, many of the ideas posited within the new gospels may be entirely attributed to early Greek philosophy. Even further, some of the mythology - including the Jesus story - bear resemblance to Greek mythology (as it does to many other pagan spirituality). Don't forget that most of these writers and philosophers were dead long before Christianity ever even began.

I could go on forever, but that would just be a waste, right?

[Spirited Away]

Oh. AND!

Most of Greek philosophers were greaty influenced by Christianity. ( i.e. Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, Herodotus, Euripedes, ) You can see Christian influence written all over.

Wait, where did you get this? Considering the timeline, I'm a little skeptical.

[Uronacid]

A few bad apples ruin the bunch... that's why I don't open my mouth as a Christian.

Christianity isn't something you can prove. It was never meant to be. It sucks. You just have to have faith. It's a choice you make. The way that many of the questions have been answered in this thread was wrong, many answers were born in ignorance.

Young Christians excited about their faith saying thing that others have told them. I don't speak up against them. Truth is, I don't know how. I'm a Christian myself. I feel as if I'm betraying my own kind. I let them fall, I held my tongue so they could learn their lesson.

[31miracles]

I grew up dirt poor.
my first residence didn't even have a roof
I didn't have a bed until I was 12
I never tasted a steak until I was 13
growing up I never had luxuries like a bike or video game, only had a few action figures
my favorite christmas present growing up was a can of spagetti-O's, and I was satifisied and excited until I ate them...
I had to work everyday for 3 hours in a our family garden that we rented in order to have food to eat.
A yummy snack for me was going to McDonald's and taking a ketchup pack.
I forced myself to love to read, because the library was free.
yea, enough rant =P

MANY OF YOU DO NOT KNOW HOW LUCKY YOU ARE.

But my parents worked hard, worked their asses off, and today, I live a pretty good life.

I don't complain much, but when people tell me it's god's work, I get angry.

Why should I be thankful for god and thank him for my new life?
Why should I give god "credit"?

sure, life is not fair, i understand that, but please, when things do get better, don't tell me it has to do with god. I will not be thankful to god for the food at my table, because the food is the result of my blood, sweat, and tears. God did shit to get me food.

How I see it, it was my parents that got us through the hard times, NOT GOD, and if there was a god, well then, he just tried to f**k my family over. If there is a god, to me, he is a mean person, and I want to fight him. That is why it is impossible for me to believe in the "miracles" of god.


please answer =D

[*Steven*]

I find it ironic that your name is 31miracles.

[Uronacid]

I grew up dirt poor.
my first residence didn't even have a roof
I didn't have a bed until I was 12
I never tasted a steak until I was 13...

Technically, what those people are telling you is correct. If you believe in God you believe that he created everything. Without God, not even your hardships would have been possible. So, is everythign a product of God? Yes. But, at the same time, everything happens for a reason. If you didn't go through those hardships then you wouldn't be the person you are today. Those hardships may have caused domino effect that will lead you to become a successful young man. You'll never know.

It sounds as if you feel people are letting God take the glory away from your parents' hard work. Well, I just think you're confused. When people say that God made it possible, they are saying that he helped your parents. Not that He made it easy, He just helped. Look, if you believe in God you believe that God helps in ways that we don't even see. Such as, chains of events that tie together and lead to our our fortune. We cannot see the ways that God helps. We just believe that he does.

Personally, I don't dig to deep. I don't thank God for each and every perceivably "random" event that turns up in my favor. I just thank God I'm alive and well. I know things could be a lot worse than they are.

[*Steven*]

But how does god select whose going to go through hardships and who isn't? Does he go eenie meenie miney mo you're going to grow up in poverty. You're going to be a transsexual homophobic jew. You're going to be a very tall asian. You're going to be normal. etc etc

[Uronacid]

But how does god select whose going to go through hardships and who isn't? Does he go eenie meenie miney mo you're going to grow up in poverty. You're going to be a transsexual homophobic jew. You're going to be a very tall asian. You're going to be normal. etc etc

I honestly don't know for sure. If I were to take a guess, I think it all has to do with balance. I don't think it's random. it could be a variety of reasons.

Actions are passed on generation by generation. Good or bad, the people of one generation will feel the repercussions of the generation before them. Their not necessarily being judge, but every reaction has an equal and opposite reaction.

If one generation doesn't feel the effects of their actions the next one might. I'm not saying that this is his (miricale's) problem. I'm just saying it might be the case. It seems his parents tried to break the cycle of poverty. Poverty may have been the result of gambling, poor money management, or even laziness in a previous generation.

Everything happens for a reason. God allows those reasons to exist. It's fair to everyone even if they didn't preform the action themselves someone must be judged for it. It's in the blood.

[*Steven*]

Kinda off topic, but what would all of y'all do if you found out in the future that Jesus was some guy from the future who decided to go back in time and implant the idea of religion in people?

[NoSex]

Christianity isn't something you can prove. It was never meant to be. It sucks. You just have to have faith. It's a choice you make.

Wow, that makes a whole load of no sense.

[brooklyneast05]

^yea about that quote. why do u believe it then? why did u make that choice and what did u base the choice off of?

if something sucks, has no evidence, and u can't prove it, that makes me not wanna choose it.

[Uronacid]

^yea about that quote. why do u believe it then? why did u make that choice and what did u base the choice off of?

if something sucks, has no evidence, and u can't prove it, that makes me not wanna choose it.

It's the whole idea behind it I think. There are so many who believe. There are so many who don't. In the end, I think it makes more sense to me. You can't prove that there is no God either. What makes you want to choose a life without him? I choose him.

I really don't care about the debate. I'm only doing this for myself. I'm a selfish, fucking, swearing Christian. I hope that I'm making a good name for Christians when I say things like this. We aren't perfect.

[*jeanna*]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o

[brooklyneast05]

It's the whole idea behind it I think. There are so many who believe. There are so many who don't. In the end, I think it makes more sense to me. You can't prove that there is no God either. What makes you want to choose a life without him? I choose him.

yeah i guess that's where we differ. just because i can't disprove him that doesn't give me a good reason to believe in him. i don't see any reason for me to. i duno, i don't care for the idea behind it though.

josh really, just quit being christian so we can hang out in hell and swear and all that good stuff

[Uronacid]

yeah i guess that's where we differ. just because i can't disprove him that doesn't give me a good reason to believe in him. i don't see any reason for me to. i duno, i don't care for the idea behind it though.

josh really, just quit being christian so we can hang out in hell and swear and all that good stuff

Lol, yeah.. I just find that it's a waste of time arguing with people who want to disprove you when it comes to religion. You really can't prove anything either way. I don't look down on anyone for believing something different. If I did, people would only think less of Christians in general. I can talk about what I believe, but I can't disprove or prove anything. In the end there is just no solid proof. That's what makes it a religion. xD

If you have questions, feel free to ask. If you're trying to disprove something, don't waste our time. ;\

[Sandraaa]

What the hell is wrong with religious people?? Why can't they all be like Podo or Josh? >< I just had a bad experience with one.

[Uronacid]

What the hell is wrong with religious people?? Why can't they all be like Podo or Josh? >< I just had a bad experience with one.

That's how I feel about black people. Your brain will stereo type people for you. Think about this:

Green and Red, which one means stop and which one means go? It's obvious. Green means go. Red means stop. Society has trained us into thinking that way. In games red units are good and red ones are bad. Red does damage and green heals you. Red is usually BAD. Green is usually GOOD. After a while your brain just makes makes choices for you because the choices become so obvious.

If you get treated a certain way by people who share a common factor whether it's religion, skin color, or even clothing style. You will react accordingly. if they treat you good, you will be attracted to them. If they treat you bad, you'll want to keep your distance.

[brooklyneast05]

more cool black people would be nice

[*Steven*]

more cool black people would be nice

He's cooler than being cool.

[Uronacid]

^ LOL

more cool black people would be nice

Yeah, I grew up in an inner city neighbor hood. It was so bad... The same way she wishes that there were more Christians like me, I wish there were more black people like you.

[Sandraaa]

I've had bad experience with Blacks too, especially girls. She almost beat me up

Black girl & friends are shouting at the school's café so me and friends turn around to look at them.

Black girl: what?
Me: what? (as in, what did you say because I didn't understand you)
B-girl: what?
Me: what?
B-girl: What what?
Me: What what what?
B-girl: -gets up- are you talking to me?
Me: yes, were you talking to me?

I might not be accurate but I think it went like that.
After a couple of attempts to hit me because I responded to her whats, I left. (I HATE FIGHTING). Later that day, she called her friends to beat me up.

I AM BLACK (with White whatever) but I AM BLACK. They called me a White wannabe and whatnot.
Anyway, I don't know that many Black people so I can't really ya know ...

But I am really prejudiced towards Arabs. Aaggh! Come live in Europe, especially Belgium and you'll see.

BLACK PEOPLE LIKE MYSELF () and JC rock!! Oh and Toya too. And used-to-be-Suzzette.

[Uronacid]

I've had bad experience with Blacks too, especially girls. She almost beat me up

Black girl & friends are shouting at the school's café so me and friends turn around to look at them.

Black girl: what?
Me: what? (as in, what did you say because I didn't understand you)
B-girl: what?
Me: what?
B-girl: What what?
Me: What what what?
B-girl: -gets up- are you talking to me?
Me: yes, were you talking to me?

I might not be accurate but I think it went like that.
After a couple of attempts to hit me because I responded to her whats, I left. (I HATE FIGHTING). Later that day, she called her friends to beat me up.

I AM BLACK (with White whatever) but I AM BLACK. They called me a White wannabe and whatnot.
Anyway, I don't know that many Black people so I can't really ya know ...

But I am really prejudiced towards Arabs. Aaggh! Come live in Europe, especially Belgium and you'll see.

BLACK PEOPLE LIKE MYSELF () and JC rock!! Oh and Toya too. And used-to-be-Suzzette.

Suzzette... I always said she was hot headed.

[31miracles]

Technically, what those people are telling you is correct. If you believe in God you believe that he created everything. Without God, not even your hardships would have been possible. So, is everythign a product of God? Yes. But, at the same time, everything happens for a reason. If you didn't go through those hardships then you wouldn't be the person you are today. Those hardships may have caused domino effect that will lead you to become a successful young man.

So thanks to god I can have hardships? um thanks? If my family didn't go through the hardships, I will tell you what I would be today. If my parents could have started college right after high school, today, we would be millionaires.
You say that hardships could make me a successful young man. Growing up poor, I know that there were many people in worse of conditions than I was in, and that directly hits my heart. I have decided that I will try to improve the world the best I can through my charity work. Now if you say that is what god meant for me to do, that's bull, because that's what I choose to do. For everything, you can make up a crap reason of what god meant. This is a favorite one I heard, "oh I broke a leg, god is telling me to spend more time at home with my family".

If one generation doesn't feel the effects of their actions the next one might. I'm not saying that this is his (miricale's) problem. I'm just saying it might be the case. It seems his parents tried to break the cycle of poverty. Poverty may have been the result of gambling, poor money management, or even laziness in a previous generation.

sorry but you are completely wrong.
our family "poverty" did not come from bad money management, laziness, or gamboling.
in fact, all my family has been the COMPLETE opposite.
one side of my family were countryside farmers and the other fishermen... in China.
so that's the problem, the society and environment.
This is true, any Chinese person with parents from the countryside can back me, our parents work harder than 99.99% of American. The stories I hear of hardships are scary.
if you are gonna argue that the actions of my pervious ancestors affect the like god had for me, then I should have a great life. My family has done, what you would call "gods work" for many people.

Back on topic.. I just don't understand how some people can believe in god. I fully agree with an idea that sprouted in the 1920's that god is the best advertiser. I see religion as too political and a means to control people.

That brings me to another question: missionaires.
Do Christians seriously believe it's right to change what other people believe? Imagine if I tried to convert you. Why, trough out history, were so many groups of people FORCED to convert?

In Chinua Achebe's famous novel, Things Fall Apart, he wrote exactly what religion/missionaries are about:
"The white man is very clever. He came quietly and peaceably with his religion. We were amused at his foolishness and allowed him to stay. Now he has won our brothers, and our clan can no longer act like one. He has put a knife on the things that held us together and we have fallen apart.”

The Boxer Rebellion that put China back was caused by the diaspora of religion.

Religion kills, go flood the world again god, go plague the Egyptians.

I seen very negative, because it's the easiest way to get my point out. However, I do respect people who believe in their religion, as long as they don't preach it. Religion is good for the morals and ethics.

The way I see it, I'm not a bad person, if there is a god and if god is the fair person that he is, I should be fine. You die, I die, We all die.

[*Steven*]

So thanks to god I can have hardships? um thanks? If my family didn't go through the hardships, I will tell you what I would be today. If my parents could have started college right after high school, today, we would be millionaires.
You say that hardships could make me a successful young man. Growing up poor, I know that there were many people in worse of conditions than I was in, and that directly hits my heart. I have decided that I will try to improve the world the best I can through my charity work. Now if you say that is what god meant for me to do, that's bull, because that's what I choose to do. For everything, you can make up a crap reason of what god meant. This is a favorite one I heard, "oh I broke a leg, god is telling me to spend more time at home with my family".
sorry but you are completely wrong.
our family "poverty" did not come from bad money management, laziness, or gamboling.
in fact, all my family has been the COMPLETE opposite.
one side of my family were countryside farmers and the other fishermen... in China.
so that's the problem, the society and environment.
This is true, any Chinese person with parents from the countryside can back me, our parents work harder than 99.99% of American. The stories I hear of hardships are scary.
if you are gonna argue that the actions of my pervious ancestors affect the like god had for me, then I should have a great life. My family has done, what you would call "gods work" for many people.

Back on topic.. I just don't understand how some people can believe in god. I fully agree with an idea that sprouted in the 1920's that god is the best advertiser. I see religion as too political and a means to control people.

That brings me to another question: missionaires.
Do Christians seriously believe it's right to change what other people believe? Imagine if I tried to convert you. Why, trough out history, were so many groups of people FORCED to convert?

In Chinua Achebe's famous novel, Things Fall Apart, he wrote exactly what religion/missionaries are about:
"The white man is very clever. He came quietly and peaceably with his religion. We were amused at his foolishness and allowed him to stay. Now he has won our brothers, and our clan can no longer act like one. He has put a knife on the things that held us together and we have fallen apart.”

The Boxer Rebellion that put China back was caused by the diaspora of religion.

Religion kills, go flood the world again god, go plague the Egyptians.

I seen very negative, because it's the easiest way to get my point out. However, I do respect people who believe in their religion, as long as they don't preach it. Religion is good for the morals and ethics.

The way I see it, I'm not a bad person, if there is a god and if god is the fair person that he is, I should be fine. You die, I die, We all die.

QQ

[Uronacid]

So thanks to god I can have hardships? um thanks? If my family didn't go through the hardships, I will tell you what I would be today. If my parents could have started college right after high school, today, we would be millionaires.
You say that hardships could make me a successful young man. Growing up poor, I know that there were many people in worse of conditions than I was in, and that directly hits my heart. I have decided that I will try to improve the world the best I can through my charity work. Now if you say that is what god meant for me to do, that's bull, because that's what I choose to do. For everything, you can make up a crap reason of what god meant. This is a favorite one I heard, "oh I broke a leg, god is telling me to spend more time at home with my family".
sorry but you are completely wrong.
our family "poverty" did not come from bad money management, laziness, or gamboling.
in fact, all my family has been the COMPLETE opposite.
one side of my family were countryside farmers and the other fishermen... in China.
so that's the problem, the society and environment.
This is true, any Chinese person with parents from the countryside can back me, our parents work harder than 99.99% of American. The stories I hear of hardships are scary.
if you are gonna argue that the actions of my pervious ancestors affect the like god had for me, then I should have a great life. My family has done, what you would call "gods work" for many people.

Back on topic.. I just don't understand how some people can believe in god. I fully agree with an idea that sprouted in the 1920's that god is the best advertiser. I see religion as too political and a means to control people.

That brings me to another question: missionaires.
Do Christians seriously believe it's right to change what other people believe? Imagine if I tried to convert you. Why, trough out history, were so many groups of people FORCED to convert?

In Chinua Achebe's famous novel, Things Fall Apart, he wrote exactly what religion/missionaries are about:
"The white man is very clever. He came quietly and peaceably with his religion. We were amused at his foolishness and allowed him to stay. Now he has won our brothers, and our clan can no longer act like one. He has put a knife on the things that held us together and we have fallen apart.” The Boxer Rebellion that put China back was caused by the diaspora of religion. Religion kills, go flood the world again god, go plague the Egyptians.

I seen very negative, because it's the easiest way to get my point out. However, I do respect people who believe in their religion, as long as they don't preach it. Religion is good for the morals and ethics. The way I see it, I'm not a bad person, if there is a god and if god is the fair person that he is, I should be fine. You die, I die, We all die.

Not necessarily, if your parents where the same people they are today then you would be millionaires, but they wouldn't be the people they are today without the hardships they endured.

Success doesn't come with just money (obviously). Without those hardships you wouldn't be the same person you are today. Your goals would be totally different. I honestly doubt you would have a heart for the poor if you grew up rich. Believe me, there is good that come out of it. In some ways, being born into a wealthy family is a curse.

I never said that your family was any of those things. I said that it may have been the result of of those things in the past. I wasn't even referring to family members you know. Also, you may have been feeling a poverty streak because of the government in China. Who knows?! Either way, your poverty as well as the poverty of many other families was probably the result of someone's sinful decision (probably many decisions of many different people). As a Christian you would believe that those people will be judged for the pain that they caused during their life time and after.

In the past people were probably forced to "convert" because the people "converting" them truly thought that they were doing the right thing. Do I believe they were doing the right thing? No, I don't think it's right for a Christian to force their religion upon someone. In fact, I think that forcing your religion upon someone is one of the most terrible things you can do to someone. How can someone truly believe in God if your ramming it down their throat? People need to make that choice on their own.

You mention God flooding the world, but in the Bible He makes a promise never to flood the world again.

Unfortunately, it doesn't matter how "good" you are on this earth. You may be "good" when being compared to Human standards, but you aren't "good" when compared to God's standards. Perfection is the only standard in Heaven. This is the whole reason Christ is the center of our religion. In our religion, if you believe in Jesus and are truly sorry for the sins you commit then Jesus will take your sins upon himself by dieing on the cross. Jesus died on the cross for the sins of those that believed in him durring past, present, and future. There always has to be a balance. For ever action there must be an equal and opposite reaction. If you sin, you must be judged for it. Jesus "pays for your sins" if you lean on him. Therefore the balance is kept. This is debatable, but I believe your still judged before you enter heaven. At the end of that judgment there will be one difference between the fate of a non-believer a believer is that one will be saved from their punishment of eternal damnation and one will not.

I hope I don't sound to preachy, I'm trying to answer these questions to the best of my ability.