Gay Marriage, Do you support or oppose? Options

[sammi rules you]

I think people need to compromise. The conservative fundamentalists of the world are overreacting to gay marriage and gay marriage supporters are pushing to hard for it to be called "marriage." Why can gays not have civil unions that have all of the legal aspects that marriage does? That way, you don't offend the church-y people who say marriage is a religious tradition, which it is, and gays can call their civil union a marriage if they want, just not legally. Plus, why should the union of two people be denied to those who want it most? Because they want it so badly, they are more likely to take it seriously and respect the institution. If people have a problem with homosexual marriage they should take a look at straight marriages because nearly 40% of those marriages fail (at least in the U.S.) Why can't we all just get along? (That is rhetorical.)

because it's still not the same. if that's allowed, why is it such a big deal to call it marriage? it's on the basis of equality, they want the SAME rights any straight person gets. if a straight person deserves to be able to get married, so should they. not that long ago, interracial couples couldn't get married. and you think that's absurd, correct? well, people then thought it was absurd for them to marry then. just as many, if not more, people were against it then than are now, but our country felt the duty to make it legal on the principle of equality. why can't we do that for gay people?

[katiekatie57]

because it's still not the same. if that's allowed, why is it such a big deal to call it marriage? it's on the basis of equality, they want the SAME rights any straight person gets. if a straight person deserves to be able to get married, so should they. not that long ago, interracial couples couldn't get married. and you think that's absurd, correct? well, people then thought it was absurd for them to marry then. just as many, if not more, people were against it then than are now, but our country felt the duty to make it legal on the principle of equality. why can't we do that for gay people?

I feel like you are completely missing my point. I approve of gay marriage/civil union/ whatever you want to call it. And for your information, I do not think interracial marriage is "absurd" because I am a product of said interracial marriage. And the principle of equality can screw itself because if you haven't noticed, women still don't have an equal rights amendment to the Constitution but that is an entirely different issue. Anyway, gays can have the same rights as straights with "civil union" and still not offend the church by calling it marriage. Compromise. That is my point.

[sammi rules you]

you're also missing my point. i never said you were against either thing, i was explaining why i don't get why it's so bad to let them get married. and if they get civil unions, it's not the same rights. it offends them that they're not allowed to get married.

[katiekatie57]

God forbid anyone get offended.

[CrimsonSkyGraphi...]

God forbid anyone get offended.

Well. Just for the sake of example..Lets say the world is mainly made up of gay people/couples and marraige is used for 'them', as it always has been. And then you come along and love someone who's not your own sex. *gasp!* All you want to do is get married like everyone else who's gay can, but people say you should get a 'civil' union instead because you're different. But a civil union 'shows' there's a seperation between the two types. Why cant you just get married like everyone else? Why must you be seperated from them?

That is a short example of how 'I' would feel if I was told to get a civil union instead of a marraige. >.>

[sammi rules you]

^ exactly, thank you.

[katiekatie57]

I feeling like I'm bashing my head against a brick wall. I really don't know what to tell you except that you can't get everything you want at once. If legislature gets passed for civil unions (I'm sorry if the terminology offends you) then once public opinion isn't so conservative and homophobic, people will realize that it’s fine if you call it marriage, whatever. I am not saying anyone else’s opinion is wrong, I'm just trying to say that in reality a gay marriage law will not pass through Congress. Plus, even if it did right now a majority of Americans would be outraged at "such an atrocity" and Bush would veto it. The first step toward gay marriage is to establish the same legal rights even if you call it by another name. During the last election, there were public opinion polls on the tickets that asked if people supported gay marriage. 25% said legal marriage, 28% said civil unions, 42 % said no legal recognition, and 5% were unsure. Clearly, most people don't want any legal recognition whatsoever. Plus, Bush already announced early in 2004 that he was going to push for a Constitutional Amendment to ban gay marriage completely. The point of all that rambling is, take what you can get and then wait until public opinion becomes less close-minded. From what I can tell, our generation doesn't really oppose same sex marriage so in the future, I'm sure it will work itself out. And I know my next statement will irritate people, but there are honestly more important things to be spending tax money on and worrying about. I don't feel that gays' basic rights as human beings are being infringed upon. What about the people in Iraq who are being killed because they want "democracy" (I use the term loosely) and to not be afraid that they're going to get blown up if they get on a train or go to the freaking market to get food. They could mysteriously disappear if they complain about all the vigilante organizations that are terrorizing them and here we are complaining about not being able to get married. I really don't mean to piss anyone off, it is simply my opinion.

[sadolakced acid]

your statistic.

25% said legal marriage, 28% said civil unions, 42 % said no legal recognition, and 5% were unsure.  Clearly, most people don't want any legal recognition whatsoever.

i assume you can add.

you said most people favor no legal recognition, but you fail to realize that the group that wants legal recognition has been divided into marraige and civil union.

therefore, 25%+28%= 53%.

the will of the majority should be served.

[tmauze]

okay i base my life off my religion, and, according to the bible, marriage is "a bound between a man and a woman." therefore, i am against gay marriage.

i've found that a lot of people think that you can't help whether or not you're gay, and i thought that for a while also. however, if you couldn't help your sexual preference, then the bible wouldn't forbid being homosexual. once again, my faith has proved to be the reason for my decision.

however, i was reading over some posts in this room and had never thought about it from the same viewpoint some of you do. like someone said that our country has always been divided because we discriminate against others, and i think this is a REALLY strong topic. like, i suppose that when americans discriminated against women, people could find bible verses and somehow twist them around so others misconstrued their meaning and took them to mean that women were weaker than men. so, i do see exactly what you're saying, and, just as we now look at the fact that people could think african americans had less potential because their skin was black as ridiculous, in 100 years people could accept gays without question.

so, all in all, i am against gay marriage, although i DO think gays deserve to be treated respectfully because they are no less than we are. i hate it when people look down on others, especially those who are different, as less than themselves. but, back to my point: although i do think that gay marriage is wrong, i see the other side also and can't help but realize that they have a valid point too. it's a big topic so you can't expect everyone to agree, and everyone disagrees for different reasons, that's what makes it so complicated.

[prayurnotheonly1]

i hate to burst yiur bubble but i agree with katiekatie57...legislature is not going to be passed on this issue.

[pandamonium]

i got an idea why dont we just do it like old times, huh! what do you say? since man and woman should be the only ones who can marry. why dont we just discriminate against black! just like old times!

[sadolakced acid]

i hate to say you're wrong, but legislature has been passed about this issue.

in massachusets, i believe.

and no federal law can be passed banning or allowing gay marraige.
so all that arguement about bush and stuff
is useless.

because marraige is a power reserved to the states in the constitution. the only thing nationwide that can be passed is an ammendment.

[UrF4vL!pGl0Z...]

I'm for it, because who are we to say who they should love and or not love. THEY CANT HELP IT. just like straights cant help who they like. its a matter of love. and I personally think if thats their preferance then good for them. I dont not resent lesbains or gays. some are my friends. <3

[katiekatie57]

.....

[sammi rules you]

^ please don't spam.

[sammi rules you]

^ please don't spam.

[antix10_kos]

Why do we spend so much time on this issue? here's how I interpret the whole gay marriage debate.

man+woman=tradition. Tradition is good, but antiquated. Maybe it's time for a change.

man+man or woman+woman=controversy. Controversy is bad to some people, but absolutely necessary if a society is to continue to grow and flourish.

What should all the equations equal: acceptance. Pass the laws and let everyone have the rights they should have. Love is still love, regardless of the gender of the person(s) involved.

Why the laws in favor of gay marriage will not be passed under this administration:

Bush administration=conservative.

Conservatives will not vote in favor of gay marriage because most of their followers and party members are very religious and according to the Bible, marriage is sacred and is only allowed between a man and a woman. any other configuration just isn't allowed. If they were to pass the law, their followers would "revolt" and the moral state of America would "decline" according to the oh-so-moral republican media. Even they were to pass the laws, many states would resist the new law. Many states have passed their own laws regarding sex civil unions and marriages. In my home state, neither a civil union or a marriage is allowed between two persons of the same sex.

Final Note: A civil union IS NOT the SAME as marriage. Marriage entitles both parties to certain rights, such as the right to be able have custody of their children, even if they divorce, the right to adopt children, as long as they do so legally, the right to joinly own property without loopholes, the right to share and liquidate all of their personal assets, i.e. Money, and the right to care for and make decisions for and regarding their loved one if they should become ill or incapicatated. Those are pretty important rights, eh?? A civil union does not give both parties these rights. Civil unions are also harder to dissolve/break up than a marriages.


It's not just a matter of what it's called people, it's about more than that....

[pandamonium]

Conservatives will not vote in favor of gay marriage because most of their followers and party members are very religious and according to the Bible, marriage is sacred and is only allowed between a man and a woman. any other configuration just isn't allowed. If they were to pass the law, their followers would "revolt" and the moral state of America would "decline" according to the oh-so-moral republican media. Even they were to pass the laws, many states would resist the new law. Many states have passed their own laws regarding sex civil unions and marriages. In my home state, neither a civil union or a marriage is allowed between two persons of the same sex.

did you know d**k cheny's (i dont know how to spell his last name) daughter is a lesbian. lol i just thought i'd tell you.

[antix10_kos]

did you know d**k cheny's (i dont know how to spell his last name) daughter is a lesbian. lol i just thought i'd tell you.

yeah, but that isn't going to influence anything. So what if Cheney's daughter is a lesbian? That fact isn't going to make the law pass....

[pandamonium]

^ i know it wont change anything. but i thought it was funny and he was interviewed and they asked him about his daughter and he said i still love her. and he never responded to the question.

[sammi rules you]

well i'm sure he still loves his daughter, but doesn't agree with her lifestyle.

again, what does that have to do with anything?? it's not funny, it's sad that her father isn't in agreement with the way she lives her life.

[sammi rules you]

no. i dont support it.
i have nothing against gay people.
but i do not agree with the lifestyle.

but what affect on you does it have if they get married?

[vampireduster]

i support it


it really shouldnt matter if two people love each other. They live together and act like they are married even though they do not have a certifcate to say yes we are married. The government should at least give them that certificate because no matter what the people will be living together and leading normal lives but wont get benefits as a married man and woman. I think they should just legalize it and get it over with. Its not gross its just some person of one sex loving another of the same sex. People are stupid I guess. It should be leagalized

[sammi rules you]

EVERYONE should read this.
by my good friend dominic.


Why anti-homosexual human beings are ignorant:

By: Me.

Why is it that you despise gays? Is it because of the Bible? Is it because in dosent exactly tie in with "nature"?? Is it because you think it's disgusting? It isn't real "Love"??

None of these are actually good solid reasons to hate a homosexual. In fact, there is no good reason to hate a homosexual. When I hear talk of anti-homosexuality, I hear ignorance and contradiction.

The Bible:

The bible clearly speaks of sodomy being a sin. So according to the bible, one can have homosexual desires his whole life, but have a perfectly clean slate as long as he dosent take it into action. Free Will?

"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

Cursed be he who does the Lords work remissly, cursed he who holds back his sword from blood. (Jeremiah 48:10 NAB)

That first passage made it clear that all homosexuals should be killed right? And who obeys the Word of God....?

Christians.

That's where the second passage ties in. Since you know, your "god" cant really KILL anyone, he obviously expects his followers to follow him. Right? So what are you waiting for? Why dont you go find an Adam and Steve and start unloading on them? Oh....Yeah. I forgot. "Thou Shalt not Kill."

Yeah. That dosent make a whole lot of sense. Homosexuals are sinning, and if you dont kill them, you're going to hell as well. So remember: God dosent want you to not talk to these people. He dosent want you to be afriad of these people. He wants you to kill these people, or he'll send you to hell.

I'd also like to add that masturbation is a sin. That was brought to my attention some time ago and I found it hilarious, since almost every christian has jerked off in the shower, yet they jump at the chance to say homosexuality is wrong. Hypicrites, hypicrites, hypicrites.

If your a firm believing Christian and you want to bash homosexuality.....

1. Kill them

2. Never masturbate again.

If this was your reason on hating homosexuality go by those two rules and you'll be fine. ^_^

Homosexuality dosen't tie in with Nature?

Who's to say what's natural and whats unnatural?

By "natural" do you mean evolutionary law? Because if that's the case, what about vegetarians? I mean, human beings are suppose to eat meat, but they choose not to, because it goes agaisnt their personal morals. Cant the same thing be said about homosexulaity?

Homosexuals choose to be the way they are?


Could you honestly imagine reforming your sexuality? I know that I couldn't. Sexuality was wired into us. In the end, I dont think anyone would want to be gay in the society that we live in. And even if someone did choose to be the way they are, who are we to say that they're wrong, and it's not real love? All homosexuality is, is a hormonal imbalance. Two men can love one another just like a male and female could.

Repeat these words: Sexualtiy is Biological. Sexuality is Biological.

Sexual stimulation is in direct relation to the brain, and also correlation between the part of the brain called the hypothalamus. The hypothalamus has obtained different chemical properties via genetics.

Would you deny a handicapped person his or her rights? No? Then whats the problem with homosexuality? In the end, when you open up your eyes, it really is the same thing.

Everyone has a seperate set of desires. All different. What may feel right for you, may not feel right for some.

For those of you who think that homosexuality is a conscience choice and your against it: That belief makes it all the more possible that you, yourself, are gay.

Sexuality is unconscience and subconscience.

Do you choose what you dream? Have you ever been turned-on in a dream? Of course you have. If not, you will in time. Did you choose to feel sexually stimulated? Of course not. It just feels right. It's your "nature."

When one hits puberty, he will know if he's gay or not. If he "chooses," he's obviously having an identity crisis and it will pass, and his real colors will show. And if they're rainbow colors, that's fine with me.

As for Gay marraige:

Do you think a marraige should built off of sexual preference, or love?

Love isnt unnatural, it's also not natural. Love is love. It holds no gender preference. Denying someone the ability to express their love is denying them love itself. But that's a whole other story...

Raising adopted love children?

First of all, I dont believe any homosexual would coach his son or daughter into being homosexual. Again, once they hit puberty, they will know where they stand on that matter. And also, no studies have shown that children raised by gay parents have had it harder than the majority. Now if it's a fat kid, with gay parents, acne, and a lisp, that's a different story. Society needs to learn how to accept people. The main problem is you. I bet the fat, acne faced, lisped boy would get made fun of just about as much even if his parents werent homosexual.

Ex-cons are allowed to get married, and raise children.

Once released from a mental hospital or prison, rapists and child molesters are allowed to raise a family. No questions asked.

I assume you see where this is all leading..I'll let it rest there.


"The funeral has taken place in the United States of Matthew Shepard, a 21 year-old student, who was savagely beaten to death because he was gay. Friends and family gathered in pouring rain at the church in the town of Casper, Wyoming, where he was baptised.

Matthew had been lured from a campus bar shortly after midnight on October 7 by two men who told him they were gay. He was driven to a remote area near the Sherman Hills neighbourhood east of Laramie, tied to a split-rail fence, tortured, beaten and pistol-whipped by his attackers, while he begged for his life; he was then left for dead in near freezing temperatures. A cyclist who found him on Snowy Mountain View Road at 6:22 pm, some 18 hours after the attack, at first mistook him for a scarecrow. He was unconscious and suffering from hypothermia. His face was caked with blood, except where it had been partially washed clean by tears.

Matthew died at 12:53 am on Monday 12th October 1998, at Poudre Valley Hospital in Fort Collins, Colorado, with his family at his bedside. Hospital officials said Matthew had a fracture from behind his head to just in front of his right ear and a massive brain stem injury which affected his vital signs, including his heart beat, body temperature and other involuntary functions. There were also approximately a dozen small lacerations around his head, face and neck. He was so badly injured in the attack that doctors were unable to operate. He never regained consciousness after being found, and remained on full life support.

While Matthew lay dying in hospital, just a few miles away, a group of students from Colorado State University thought it would be funny to ride atop a homecoming float that featured a scarecrow figure designed to resemble Matthew's battered body. The figure was wearing a sign that said "I'm gay." An obscene message was painted across the back of the scarecrow's shirt. The students didn't mean to be insensitive. It was supposed to be a joke. They were just ordinary, average guys, having a bit of fun.

Matthew was born Dec. 1, 1976, in Casper, and was the oldest son of Judy Peck Shepard and Dennis Shepard. While living in Casper, he attended Crest Hill Grade School, Dean Morgan Junior High, and completed his sophomore year in Natrona County High School. He was a member and an acolyte in St. Mark's Episcopal Church.

He attended the last two years of high school at the American School in Switzerland, where he graduated in 1995. After graduation from high school, he attended Catawba College in Salisbury, N.C.,and Casper College. He then moved to Denver, where he had several jobs. He was a first- year political science major at the University of Wyoming in Laramie at the time of his death.

He enjoyed the theatre and had parts in several Casper College and Stage III Theater plays. He liked soccer, swimming, running, camping, hunting, fishing and snow skiing; as well as dancing and theatre.

Matthew was gentle of demeanour and passionate about human rights and foreign relations. Friends described him as a small man - 5-foot-2, 110 pounds - with a big heart. "He would do anything for anybody".

Matthew was killed to make a point. His fragile, broken body was left strung up like an animal as a clear message to gay men everywhere. How can someone be so consumed with hatred for a fellow human being that atrocities like this happen? Why is homosexuality even an issue? Why does it excite such feelings of hatred and violence in people, when their lives will never be touched by it? Why is a person's sexuality anyone else's business; and who are we to judge other people? "



Wouldnt you like to see Matthew go to hell? I mean, he is immoral and sinful right?

Do you congratulate his murderers for following God's word?

In the end, in this sick twisted world, Matthew is the bad guy. His attackers are your classmates. They are your neighbors....just doing what they think is "right."

Is homosexuality really the problem?


Killing the innocent. Killing, killing, and more killing in the name of God.

"And I say to myself.....What a wonderful world"......

[sammi rules you]

BUMP so people don't make another duplicate topic.