Don't Ask, Don't Tell, Homosexuals in the Military |
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 Jun 6 2007, 07:13 PM
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#1
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 Photoartist  Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 12,363 Joined: Apr 2006 Member No: 399,390  |
Openly gay people are banned from the military. However, you can be "in the closet" and still serve, as long as you don't reveal your sexual orientation. The "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy is often mentioned in these sort of debates.
If a soldier's homosexuality does happen to be revealed, however, they are to immediately be discharged. There have been some unfair discharges, however. In one case, one homosexual soldier was harassed with e-mails, and eventually, this anonymous person e-mailed the whole battalion, warning them that there was a homosexual soldier among them. His homosexuality was eventually revealed, and was immediately discharged. His roll in the military was an Arabic translator, which are extremely helpful to have, and not very easy to find. People supporting the discharging of homosexuals testify that they cannot allow such immoral behaviour within the military. They also say that it is detrimental to the military to have such "unique" individuals (where the goal is to have cohesive groups of soldiers that are preferably as closely alike as possible). Discuss, please. |
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Jun 6 2007, 07:53 PM
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#2
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 Kimberly Group: Member Posts: 1,961 Joined: Apr 2005 Member No: 121,599 |
Not being able to be gay in the military is total bull. If a person wants to serve their country, then why should their sexuality matter? Having gay men and straight men around each other is no different than having men and women serving aside each other - something that is allowed.
Who says its immoral... The Bible??? Sheesh, what ever happened to separation of church and state? |
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Jun 6 2007, 07:54 PM
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#3
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Photoartist Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 12,363 Joined: Apr 2006 Member No: 399,390 |
QUOTE(kimmytree @ Jun 6 2007, 08:53 PM)  Not being able to be gay in the military is total bull. If a person wants to serve their country, then why should their sexuality matter? Having gay men and straight men around each other is no different than having men and women serving aside each other - something that is allowed. That's almost exactly the first things that went through my mind.
Who says its immoral... The Bible??? Sheesh, what ever happened to separation of church and state? |
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Jun 6 2007, 08:02 PM
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#4
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Kimberly Group: Member Posts: 1,961 Joined: Apr 2005 Member No: 121,599 |
It's not like straight soilders would be forced to bathe or room with them. Awhile back my American History teacher said that gays shouldnt be in the military... because then they would have the health benefits. And it would end up costing us more to pay for their healthcare, since all gay supposedly have aids and std's.
My God, if they're willing to risk their lives to serve their country... who cares what kind of medical bills they rack up. |
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Jun 6 2007, 08:06 PM
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#5
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 Member Group: Member Posts: 29 Joined: Apr 2007 Member No: 515,825 |
QUOTE(Arjuna Capulong @ Jun 6 2007, 07:13 PM) People supporting the discharging of homosexuals testify that they cannot allow such immoral behaviour within the military. Anyone is capable of having "immoral behavior" and they shouldn't classify homosexuals like that. I think that's bs and it's just another type of unfair treatment. I really wonder how the future will be if we have more conflicts like this. |
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Jun 6 2007, 08:24 PM
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#6
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Photoartist Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 12,363 Joined: Apr 2006 Member No: 399,390 |
QUOTE(oh snaap. @ Jun 6 2007, 09:06 PM) Anyone is capable of having "immoral behavior" and they shouldn't classify homosexuals like that. I think that's bs and it's just another type of unfair treatment. I really wonder how the future will be if we have more conflicts like this. At one point, it was actually supposed to go that it wouldn't matter that they were homosexual up until they started exhibiting sexuality (like everybody else). Except, they never followed through to that. |
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Jun 6 2007, 09:01 PM
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#7
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Kimberly Group: Member Posts: 1,961 Joined: Apr 2005 Member No: 121,599 |
I think Clinton came up with the policy during his second term. Could that be because Republicans have had control of Congress/Senate since then (up until now)?
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| *steve330* |
Jun 6 2007, 09:42 PM
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#8
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Guest |
I think it's stupid too. However, you have to keep in mind a lot of what goes on in the military is heavily disciplined and moral is kept under close watch (ignore Iraq). Some people can be homophobic (closed minded asshats) and cause unrest etc, and that's the last thing the military needs happening. I mean while I'm not supporting their banning of openly gay people from the military, I AM saying that we have no need to intervene in the military.
I've seen a shitload of military bases and been in a heavily military immersed environment for about 4 years of my life (ROTC). The military runs fine the way it is now, and the media and civilians need not control any single part of it. |
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Jun 7 2007, 01:32 PM
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#9
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 hardxcore. Group: Member Posts: 1,223 Joined: Nov 2006 Member No: 479,494 |
that's bull. if someone is willing to sacrafice(sp?), what does their orientation matter? jeez. this just...argh.
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| *karmakiller* |
Jun 7 2007, 01:43 PM
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#10
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I don't think it should matter if they are or are not homosexual. It shouldn't matter, just because you're a homosexual doesn't mean that you aren't as tough as straight people.
However, I don't think they should be throwing it around if they are a homosexual, because it really doesn't have anything to do with their job. If they are openly gay, a lot of times that will make them the subject of a lot of harassment, so I don't think that there will be gays telling everyone in the military their status and wearing rainbows on their uniforms any time soon. I know people will disagree with me, but it's true. I've heard stories that I never really wanted to  I guess what I'm trying to say is, if you were gay and in the military why would be throwing it out there and showing your gay pride? They'd get harassed so badly and, like I already said, it has nothing to do with their job |
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Jun 7 2007, 01:48 PM
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#11
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Photoartist Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 12,363 Joined: Apr 2006 Member No: 399,390 |
QUOTE(karmakiller @ Jun 7 2007, 02:43 PM) I don't think it should matter if they are or are not homosexual. It shouldn't matter, just because you're a homosexual doesn't mean that you aren't as tough as straight people. Nah, I agree with you completely. It's the same with women. You're not supposed to be going around seducing other men (or women, for that matter).However, I don't think they should be throwing it around if they are a homosexual, because it really doesn't have anything to do with their job. If they are openly gay, a lot of times that will make them the subject of a lot of harassment, so I don't think that there will be gays telling everyone in the military their status and wearing rainbows on their uniforms any time soon. I know people will disagree with me, but it's true. I've heard stories that I never really wanted to The thing is, as soon as someone finds out you're gay, you're out. QUOTE(karmakiller @ Jun 7 2007, 02:43 PM) They'd get harassed so badly and, like I already said, it has nothing to do with their job That's some Brokeback Mountain ish right there.
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Jun 7 2007, 05:52 PM
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#12
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 d@niel Group: Member Posts: 1,267 Joined: Jan 2005 Member No: 91,453 |
yea, the whole issue is weird...everyone should be accepted no matter what
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Jun 8 2007, 07:53 PM
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#13
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 ♥ Group: Member Posts: 287 Joined: Apr 2007 Member No: 518,690 |
Thats gay... (no pun intended).
Why should their sexual orientation mattter, theyre there to serve their country- not pick up guys 
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Jun 9 2007, 02:03 PM
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#14
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 CB's Forum Troll Group: Member Posts: 926 Joined: Mar 2005 Member No: 115,142 |
gay people are proven to be less effective fighters
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Jun 9 2007, 07:40 PM
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#15
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Kimberly Group: Member Posts: 1,961 Joined: Apr 2005 Member No: 121,599 |
^ Mind backing that statement up? lol.
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| *inspiration* |
Jun 9 2007, 09:35 PM
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#16
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http://threepanelsoul.com/view.php?date=2007-05-30
Homosexuality is becoming less taboo as time progresses, and because we are the future, things will start to change (if they haven't already). |
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Jun 9 2007, 10:54 PM
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#17
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 Senior Member Group: Member Posts: 2,746 Joined: May 2004 Member No: 17,125 |
This is not a bible matter, nor an issue of morality. The entire don't ask don't tell policy makes perfect sense.
Some people are not comfortable changing, showering, sleeping, and living with homosexuals. If a person is openly gay, not only would he make others uncomfortable, but he would call for unwanted attention to himself. What good would that do for anyone? Homosexuality itself should not be an issue in the military, but the discussion of it or confession of it should be controlled. Its the military, not your mother's house. Life is not fair, and the military isn't there to make you feel good about yourself. If a soldier feels proud enough to absolutely have to display his sexuality to other soldiers despite the obvious fact that it makes some uncomfortable, he should be responsible for its circumstances. If you want to serve your country, serve it. Confessing yourself has nothing to do with serving, and if it lowers productivity, it should be avoided for the sake of serving peacefully. QUOTE(Arjuna Capulong @ Jun 7 2007, 02:48 PM) Nah, I agree with you completely. It's the same with women. You're not supposed to be going around seducing other men (or women, for that matter). But do women sleep, shower, and so on with men? They have their own quarters. Gay's don't, they stay with the rest of the men at all times. Besides, its not the homosexual's who'd have the problems, it would be the straight men who'd feel uncomfortable soaping their ass around someone who could be potentially attracted to them. |
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Jun 9 2007, 11:04 PM
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#18
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Member Group: Member Posts: 16 Joined: Jun 2007 Member No: 533,151 |
i kno this is a stupid question n i kno that people get offended often by it but im curious are u born gay or is it a coice
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Jun 9 2007, 11:39 PM
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#19
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Senior Member Group: Member Posts: 2,746 Joined: May 2004 Member No: 17,125 |
Oh God, no. Please, don't let this topic spiral down into 'choice or not a choice' again.
Its been posted. Search? |
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| *MyMichelle* |
Jun 10 2007, 01:34 PM
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#20
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While I disagree with the fact that homosexuals that are revealed are instantly discharged, I think that having a policy of keeping your sexuality, whether it be homo or hetero, is better for all.
Allowing homosexuals to serve does not, in any way, mean that there is "immoral behavior" either. It's the straight man's choice to have butt-sex with a gay man if it happens. |
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Jun 16 2007, 09:36 PM
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#21
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Photoartist Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 12,363 Joined: Apr 2006 Member No: 399,390 |
QUOTE(ermfermoo @ Jun 9 2007, 11:54 PM) Some people are not comfortable changing, showering, sleeping, and living with homosexuals. If a person is openly gay, not only would he make others uncomfortable, but he would call for unwanted attention to himself. What good would that do for anyone? Homosexuality itself should not be an issue in the military, but the discussion of it or confession of it should be controlled. Its the military, not your mother's house. Life is not fair, and the military isn't there to make you feel good about yourself. If a soldier feels proud enough to absolutely have to display his sexuality to other soldiers despite the obvious fact that it makes some uncomfortable, he should be responsible for its circumstances. If you want to serve your country, serve it. Confessing yourself has nothing to do with serving, and if it lowers productivity, it should be avoided for the sake of serving peacefully. But do women sleep, shower, and so on with men? They have their own quarters. Gay's don't, they stay with the rest of the men at all times. Besides, its not the homosexual's who'd have the problems, it would be the straight men who'd feel uncomfortable soaping their ass around someone who could be potentially attracted to them. QUOTE(MyMichelle @ Jun 10 2007, 02:34 PM) While I disagree with the fact that homosexuals that are revealed are instantly discharged, I think that having a policy of keeping your sexuality, whether it be homo or hetero, is better for all. Agreed and agreed.
Allowing homosexuals to serve does not, in any way, mean that there is "immoral behavior" either. It's the straight man's choice to have butt-sex with a gay man if it happens. |
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Jun 19 2007, 08:59 AM
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#22
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hardxcore. Group: Member Posts: 1,223 Joined: Nov 2006 Member No: 479,494 |
QUOTE(ermfermoo @ Jun 9 2007, 11:54 PM) This is not a bible matter, nor an issue of morality. The entire don't ask don't tell policy makes perfect sense. Some people are not comfortable changing, showering, sleeping, and living with homosexuals. If a person is openly gay, not only would he make others uncomfortable, but he would call for unwanted attention to himself. What good would that do for anyone? Homosexuality itself should not be an issue in the military, but the discussion of it or confession of it should be controlled. Its the military, not your mother's house. Life is not fair, and the military isn't there to make you feel good about yourself. If a soldier feels proud enough to absolutely have to display his sexuality to other soldiers despite the obvious fact that it makes some uncomfortable, he should be responsible for its circumstances. If you want to serve your country, serve it. Confessing yourself has nothing to do with serving, and if it lowers productivity, it should be avoided for the sake of serving peacefully. But do women sleep, shower, and so on with men? They have their own quarters. Gay's don't, they stay with the rest of the men at all times. Besides, its not the homosexual's who'd have the problems, it would be the straight men who'd feel uncomfortable soaping their ass around someone who could be potentially attracted to them. who's to say that the gay men are comfortable with the straight men? it's just pure discrimination against individuality. |
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Jun 19 2007, 04:09 PM
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#23
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CB's Forum Troll Group: Member Posts: 926 Joined: Mar 2005 Member No: 115,142 |
gay ppl suck
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Jun 19 2007, 04:32 PM
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#24
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hardxcore. Group: Member Posts: 1,223 Joined: Nov 2006 Member No: 479,494 |
QUOTE(magicfann @ Jun 19 2007, 05:09 PM) gay ppl suck offensive much? seriously. take other people's belifs into concern rather than making yourself look like a dunce. 
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Jun 22 2007, 08:21 AM
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#25
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Senior Member Group: Member Posts: 88 Joined: Jun 2007 Member No: 534,037 |
QUOTE(kimmytree @ Jun 6 2007, 08:53 PM) Not being able to be gay in the military is total bull. If a person wants to serve their country, then why should their sexuality matter? Having gay men and straight men around each other is no different than having men and women serving aside each other - something that is allowed. Who says its immoral... The Bible??? Sheesh, what ever happened to separation of church and state? I agree completely.
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