is it animal cruelty? Options

[CrimsonArchangel]

No, this is not about fur, or wool or anything like that.

Its about science. Many of you have had to dissect several creatures for bio class, most likely. Today I had to do the frog ringer lab, where a frog has its brain removed (is it really dead?) and then we have to dissect it and add chemicals to its heart to see what happens, then add a third one that will kill it.

Now I ask. Despite the fact that many of those animals are bred for that purpose, "to further science", should we use animals as dissection subjects? Or should we just make plastic models and the such?

Is it animal cruelty to breed animals for the purpose of being cut up by students just to learn?

[racoons > you]

yes.

[karrar]

It is animal cruelty,but you can not risk a Human's life, so it's probaly nothing you can do about it . I Heard about some company getting sued becuase they where testing there product on animal's. If they do not test their products on animals, then how can they further their knowledge on the product so they canrelease medicine and other item's needed.

[racoons > you]

^^ what kind of company, if its cosmetics then its disgusting, because thats not at all esential for human survival.

and there are other ways of doing research for medical purposes. the human genome project, stem cells etc.

[karrar]

Human Genome project and stem cells still are not in full effect , people need result's now . A human's life can not be taken , So testing on animals is the only answer.

[CrimsonArchangel]

Humans *are* used for dissection. I've done it already. The thing with them is that they agree to let their bodies be used for that purpose. They die naturally (or from whatever disease they have) and then their bodies are given to med schools to use for about a year, after which they are returned to whatever company they donated their bodies to to be cremated and given proper burial.

About animals being used to test medicines and what not, that is another debate topic. What I'm talking about is dissection. There are companies that breed frogs for the purpose of dissection. Is *that* animal cruelty? How about the cats used for anatomy. They come from shelters. They are literally the *excess* animals that were going to be euthanized anyway. Is *that* animal cruelty? The fetal pigs are by-products of pork eaters. They take the mothers and adult animals and kill them to be eaten and they sell the fetal pigs to be dissected. Is *that* animal cruelty?

I say all of this because I've looked around and I asked my professor, so I have back up for that info.

[heyyfrankie]

this is a good point. from someone else's point of view, it could be considered cruelty. but me, i don't really consider it. i mean, we aren't just killing it for the fun of it; we are getting some knowledge out of it. but i am not totally 100% sure wether i think it is cruelty or not...

[cRaZiiXbEauTiFul]

^^ agreed,...but wait...you take out the frogs brain before you kill it??

[sporadic]

........It was still alive....?

[CrimsonArchangel]

^^ agreed,...but wait...you take out the frogs brain before you kill it??

Quoting my professor, "What do you define as alive?", meaning that to them, having no brain meant being dead... so I really don't know... The brain was removed and then we opened up its chest and fiddled around with its heart... it was unnerving to say the least...

Yes, dissecting animals can be a learning experience, but how about plastic models? How about realistic gel models that can also be dissected but are not impregnated with formaldehyde (that stuff can stuck in your nose for days...)?

[Gypsy Eyes]

Oi vey, i'm going o try not to go overboard on this. A few friends and I actually led a petition to remove animal dissectons from the ciriculum. It almost worked. *cough* anyway.

I personally feel that it is indeed animal cruelty. "oh it's necessary". I is not. There are many movies about it. If you were to watch a movie compared to doing a dissection, there would only be one animal dead instead of over a hundred.

and kaar. Where did you get animal testing from? Please stick to the topic, if you wish to post about animal testing, do it in the proper thread

[racoons > you]

^^ i'll sign

i will just say, that ive never actually found disection useful, it never looks like the diagrams and i cant find the right parts. it just upsets me

[sammi rules you]

i don't think they're supposed to be alive when you dissect them..if they were alive, then that's not right.

[gelionie]

If the animals died naturally, then I think it's okay to dissect them for research/study purposes. Otherwise, I think it's really cruel to do so.

[racoons > you]

i don't think they're supposed to be alive when you dissect them..if they were alive, then that's not right.

we did a live worm disection in 7th grade. the poor things wouldnt stop wiggli ng even when they were cut open *shudders*

[CrimsonArchangel]

If the animals died naturally, then I think it's okay to dissect them for research/study purposes. Otherwise, I think it's really cruel to do so.

I agree with ^.

That's why I'm ok with human dissection. The human cadavers belong to people that died naturally and consented to the dissections being done.

[sammi rules you]

we did a live worm disection in 7th grade. the poor things wouldnt stop wiggli ng even when they were cut open *shudders*

if you cut a worm in half it's still alive and forms into two different worms so..that should be ok.

[eunie03]

I don't think you should do anything to "animals" what you wouldn't do to humans.

Would you drench a premature baby in formaldehyde, cut it open, and see what spills out?

The pomposity of humans.

[racoons > you]

if you cut a worm in half it's still alive and forms into two different worms so..that should be ok.

no... we sliced it open down the middle length wys, not totally in half, but like spread it out. it was not pleasant

[Sumiaki]

I don't think you should do anything to "animals" what you wouldn't do to humans.

Would you drench a premature baby in formaldehyde, cut it open, and see what spills out?

The pomposity of humans.

Yes... lets eat humans.

[CrimsonArchangel]

I don't think you should do anything to "animals" what you wouldn't do to humans.

Would you drench a premature baby in formaldehyde, cut it open, and see what spills out?

The pomposity of humans.

Well, maybe not cut them open, but they already do drench premature babies in formaldehyde and keep them for display. I've seen a couple.
What about that?

[Spirited Away]

Well, maybe not cut them open, but they already do drench premature babies in formaldehyde and keep them for display. I've seen a couple.
What about that?

That is depraved and perverse.

[eunie03]

Well, maybe not cut them open, but they already do drench premature babies in formaldehyde and keep them for display. I've seen a couple.
What about that?

I'm not saying it's RIGHT. Both are ridiculous. I'm just saying... why are we doing this in the first place? For studies? I mean.. we've done it once already. We know what's in there. I doubt we grew another heart since the last time we checked.

I just find it a little off-setting that they make children do it in a lab.

Same goes for the person who said "Let's eat humans". What's wrong with just eating what we sow.

[racoons > you]

Same goes for the person who said "Let's eat humans". What's wrong with just eating what we sow.

amen. i wish i could be a veggie.... i like meat far too much. i tend to get bacon withdrawl symptoms every time i try. i do try not to eat meat as much as possibl ehowever

[eunie03]

amen. i wish i could be a veggie.... i like meat far too much. i tend to get bacon withdrawl symptoms every time i try. i do try not to eat meat as much as possibl ehowever