Questions to Christians... Options

[KissMe2408]

UninspiredFae...I've noticed that you have many good questions about christianity that you posted And I would like to answer them...to start off, you've made some great points, and i've had the same questions before i was a christian...I'll try to answer the questions as best as i can.

QUOTE(uninspiredfae @ Jun 22 2004, 4:51 PM )
There you go. God will forgive you if you believe in Him.
I do not mean to sound rude, but that sounds like bribery to me: I'll give you my belief (thus my free will) in turn for forgiveness...
Just doesn't make sense for a kind and loving God to ask for that...  it sounds like a business deal.

The thing is, God forgives you even without excepting him. Everytime you sin, he notices, but he forgives us. When he died on the cross, he basically took the blame for all our sins. So he did more then forgive you, he basically took your consequences But like you said, we still have our freedom of choice. We can choose to accept what he did for us, and believe he is or savior, or we can reject him or simply not believe. God says that we don't have to work our way into heaven, or buy or way. All we have to do is believe and accept that jesus created the heavens and the earth, and he is God and he took away our sins What a blessing that is!

Okay, here's the thing: You or someone said earlier that people who heard of Jesus and choose not to believe will go to Hell. Well guess what? Christianity then is something that condems people to Hell. Why? If a person has never heard of God, then they'd be an innocent and must still go to Hell because God doesn't (cannot) help those who do not believe in Him (almost like He's helpless to help, thus contradicting His title as an all powerful being). Christianity (more specifically, some Christians rather) then, forces a person to believe, or suffer the consequence of Hell... not much free will there if you ask me.

Yes, some people have never heard about God or read a bible. That's why it is us Christians jobs and Missionaries to spread the word of God around the world. That is why missionairies are so important. God can help and does help those who don't believe in him. He loves them, just the same as he loves a christian. But he gave you free choice. If you choose to reject him, then God isn't going to make you believe in him. He wants you to believe on your own free will. God can do anything, but it is his will and plan to give everyone their own free choice. some christians do try to scare people in believing. Which grieves God. Not all christians represent GOd like they should be doing. But what they should be doing is also spreading the word of God, and telling others and leading others to Christ, so they can share in his blessings.

I understand that good Christians do have good intentions, but ethical, and moral people have good intentions as well. We do not care to be in Heaven, because we believe that if such a place exists, then it would not turn away righteous people. There is no goodness in anything that punish good people or make virtuous people suffer.

God is not trying to punish the morally good people. But what's so great about God is that you don't need to do good works to get into heaven. You just have to believe in him. When jesus died on the cross, there were two men with him that died beside him. One man, was one the cross for murder and he said to jesus that he believed he was God and not to forget him. Jesus responded that "today you will be with me in paradise"...the man on the cross was morally wrong his entire life, but he accepted jesus...and god took all his sins and was with him in heaven. You can be the best person in the world morally, but all that doesn't matter for your etneral life. God's salvation is a gift..not a business deal...If you don't accept the gift then he can't bless you with eternal life.

Here's how I see it: non-believers chose not to believe because they were given the gift of choice. However, this "gift" is very deceptive. It says you can have a choice to believe or disbelieve, but believe in the wrong thing and you'll be punished for all of eternity. Many non-believers choose to be true to themselves and do what is right with or without religion. God, however, is unforgiving to this kind of attitude since He wants to be loved by everyone.

That is a very good point, and i said the same thing before i was saved. But what i have learned through my walk with God is that He loves everyone. No matter if they accept him or not. He forgives everyone whether they accpet him or not. He knows everything about you, he knows how many hairs are on ur head, how many sins you have committed, every thought, every time you did anything. But he still loves you. That kind of love puzzled me. But i'm understanding it more and more every day. You have to understand that good morals have nothing to do with getting into heaven. The only way to get into heaven is through God. He gave you a choice whether to accept him or not, he gave you a choice between heaven and hell...which i think is amazing. For all us humans do, and how disgusting we are, he still loves us and gives us these choices.

Question: is not beliving in Jesus a sin?

"For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans.

not believing in jesus is not technically a sin according to the bible, but since the sins of adam and eve we all have generational sins, so we're eternally seperated from God, The only way to break that seperation is through the sacraficial blood of jesus christ, which he shed on the cross, so all we have to do is accept. I hope that made sense. Feel Free to post anymore questions. I hope that I helped and cleared any questions you had

[Azn Kid from NY]

God, if She truly exists... probably just doesnt care about us anymore and left...

i mean, how do u explain all this suffering and misery in our world? if God LOVES us so much, then why does this stuff happen to us...dont give me all that "God works in mysterious ways" bullshit...give me a clean straight answer

[Spirited Away]

First, to Bellpepper:

I appreciate the Bible quotes so I'm sure you'll appreciate some things from my lovely book titled "The Anti-Christ". Now, it will be a little hard to follow as the author is one of the greatest minds in philosophy, but I'm sure the idea is hard to miss.

"What is good?--Whatever augments the feeling of power, the will to power, power itself, in man.

What is evil?-- Whatever springs from weakness.

What is happiness?-- The feeling that power increases--that resistance is overcome.

Not contentment, but more power; not peace at any price, but war; not virtue, but efficiency )virtue in the Renaissance sense, virtu, virtue free of moral acid).

The weak and the botched shall perish: first principle of our charity. And one should help them to it.

What is more harmful than any vice--Pratical sympathy for the botched and the weak--Christianity...."

Next, for a better understanding, note that the "higher type of man" basically means those who are not Christian, or not religiously devoted, according to the author.

"We should not deck out and embellish Christianity: it has waged a war to the death against this higher type of man, it has put all the deepest instincts of this tyope under its ban, it has developed its concept of evil, of the Evil One himself, out of these instincts--the strong man as the typical repobate, the 'outcast among men'. Christianity has taken the part of all the weak, the low, the botched; it has made an ideal out of antagonism to all the self-preservative instincts of sound life; it has corrupted even the faculties of those nautres that are intellectually most vigorous, but representing the highest intellectual values as sinful, as misleading, as full of temptation. The most lamentable exanple: the corruption of Pascal, who believed that his intellect had been destroyed by original sin, whereas it was actually destroyted by Christianity!--"

Want more? Sure you do! You gave me more than a page of verses from the Bible!

"Christianity is called the religion of pity.--Pity stands in opposition to all the tonic passions that augment the energy of the feeling of aliveness: it is a depressant. A man loses power when the pities. Through pity that drain upon strength which suffering works is multiplied a thousandfold. Suffering made contagious by pity; under certain circumstances it may lead to a total sacrifice of life and living energy--a loss out of all proportion to the magnitude of the cause (the case of the death of the Nazarene). This is the first view of it; there is, however, a still more important one. If one measures the effects of pity the gravity of the reactions it sets up, its character as a menace to life appears in a much clearer light. Pity thwarts the whole law of evolution, which is the law of natural selection. It preserves whatever is right for destruction; it fights on the side of ththose disinherited and condemned by life; by maintaining life in so many of the botched of all kinds, it gives life itself a gloomy and dubious aspect......"

And so on. I'm sure there are many mistyped words. It's because I'm typing from a book instead of copying and pasting things down. Hmm... Anyway, there's a lot more to that, but not much anyone could understand without reading the whole thing.




Secondly, thank you KissMe for taking the time to answer my question from the "heart". Though I may not agree with you, I still appreciate the fact that you believe because your heart wills you so, while others simple believe because the Bible tell them to. I'm sorry if you were offended by what I quoted from my book, but know that Christianity is harsh in critizing other religions since the rise of its popularity. Thanks again, and here's my response:

God says that we don't have to work our way into heaven, or buy or way. All we have to do is believe and accept that jesus created the heavens and the earth, and he is God and he took away our sins   What a blessing that is!

What about those who actually want to work to go to Heaven? What about those who live a virtuous life to go to Heaven? What about those who just live a virtuous life and don't care about Heaven and Hell? They don't have a say. They don't have a choice because the choice is ALREADY made: believe and the reward is Heaven.

Yes, some people have never heard about God or read a bible. That's why it is us Christians jobs and Missionaries to spread the word of God around the world. That is why missionairies are so important. 

Wait. Do those who have never heard of God still go to Hell if they remain ignorant about God all their life?

God can help and does help those who don't believe in him. He loves them, just the same as he loves a christian. But he gave you free choice. If you choose to reject him, then God isn't going to make you believe in him. He wants you to believe on your own free will. God can do anything, but it is his will and plan to give everyone their own free choice. some christians do try to scare people in believing. Which grieves God. Not all christians represent GOd like they should be doing.  But what they should be doing is also spreading the word of God, and telling others and leading others to Christ, so they can share in his blessings.

Yes, God gave free will and wants a person to believe on their own free will. However, do you know that free will is something limitless? When God gave Man that gift of free will, God gave Man poison.

A scenerio:
I do drugs. My Father loves me, I hate him as most druggies hate the people who keep them from their "happiness". However, my Father wants me to quit so he decides on two possible things to do: to love me unconditionally and help me fight against my addiction, or to love me unconditionally and let me do as I like until I learn of the consequences on my own.

The first outcome is simple. He loves me unconditionally and helps me, though I fight him, he still loves me and do not let me go until I suceed against the evils of drug use. It's possible that I still hate him because if it wasn't for the fact that he left me to fend for myself, I wouldn't even have fallen into such a state. Though, because my father loves me unconditionally, he still loves despite my hate and do not let me go on my own. I still have a choice now to love or hate him, but it matters not because he won't let me hurt myself.

The second outcome can easily be imagine as it happens to all who cannot let go of their addiction. I die. He loves me but he thinks that I can work things out on my own. Not to say that I cannot, but I am not as perfect as my Father. I am not as wise as he and thus I am PRONE to make mistakes. My Father loves me, but he will not interfere with my choice to continue doing drugs.

Now then to tie this back with our discusion, substitue the drug for disbelief, substitute "Father" for "God", and think of dying as going to Hell. In which example is God loving and is doing what's good for me? And in which example is God loving but allows me to walk the path of suffering?

God is not trying to punish the morally good people. But what's so great about God is that you don't need to do good works to get into heaven. You just have to believe in him. When jesus died on the cross, there were two men with him that died beside him. One man, was one the cross for murder and he said to jesus that he believed he was God and not to forget him. Jesus responded that "today you will be with me in paradise"...the man on the cross was morally wrong his entire life, but he accepted jesus...and god took all his sins and was with him in heaven. You can be the best person in the world morally, but all that doesn't matter for your etneral life. God's salvation is a gift..not a business deal...If you don't accept the gift then he can't bless you with eternal life.

Again, what if a person wants to do good? It doesn't matter because they'd go to Hell anyway. If believing in Jesus is all it takes to get into Heaven, then I might as well live a life of decadence and, at the end of it, seek God's forgiveness...

I already accept His gift of free will. His gift of free will allows me to live for myself, to think for myself, to believe as free will allow: to believe in anything. I simply believe in disbelief and the consequence is eternal pain. If God loves unconditionally, then why wouldn't he just allow everyone to be in Heaven?

That is a very good point, and i said the same thing before i was saved. But what i have learned through my walk with God is that He loves everyone. No matter if they accept him or not. He forgives everyone whether they accpet him or not. He knows everything about you, he knows how many hairs are on ur head, how many sins you have committed, every thought, every time you did anything. But he still loves you. That kind of love puzzled me. But i'm understanding it more and more every day. You have to understand that good morals  have nothing to do with getting into heaven. The only way to get into heaven is through God.  He gave you a choice whether to accept him or not, he gave you a choice between heaven and hell...which i think is amazing. For all us humans do, and how disgusting we are, he still loves us and gives us these choices. 

Again, if God loves unconditionally, then why wouldn't he just allow everyone to be in Heaven? Instead, why must we "believe" to be in Heaven?

"For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans.
not believing in jesus is not technically a sin according to the bible, but since the sins of adam and eve we all have generational sins, so we're eternally seperated from God, The only way to break that seperation is through the sacraficial blood of jesus christ, which he shed on the cross, so all we have to do is accept.    I hope that made sense. Feel Free to post anymore questions. I hope that I helped and cleared any questions you had

Why were Adam and Eve sinful? I know the story of Satan disguised as a snake to tempt Eve, but tell me why and how they could sin when they were so perfect?

[Superkid]

God, if She truly exists... probably just doesnt care about us anymore and left...

i mean, how do u explain all this suffering and misery in our world? if God LOVES us so much, then why does this stuff happen to us...dont give me all that "God works in mysterious ways" bullshit...give me a clean straight answer

Why is there evil and suffering in the world?
The question implies that if a good God exists, then evil shouldn't because God being all powerful should stop it.
We need to ask and answer two questions. First, what is evil? It is that which is against God. It is anything morally bad or wrong. It is injurious, depraved, wicked. Some acceptable examples might be murder, rape, stealing, lying, and cheating. Second, if we want God to stop evil do we want Him to stop all evil or just some of it? In other words, if just some of it then why? If He were to stop only part of the evil, then we would still be asking the question, "Why is there evil in the world?".
Let's suppose that someone was about to commit murder. God would have to stop him, maybe whisper in his ear, or if that didn't work do something a little more drastic like have something fall on him, or stop his heart, or make his hands suddenly fall off. Anyway, God would have to do something.
What if somebody wanted to steal? God would have to stop him too, right? Undoubtedly, God's imagination would permit a more practical method than I have suggested, but the end results would be the same.
What about lying? If someone were to tell a lie, then to be consistent wouldn't you want God right there to stop that person from lying? After all, He couldn't let any evil occur could He?
Let's take it a step further. Suppose someone thought something evil. Then, of course, God would have to step in and prevent him from thinking anything bad at all, right? The end result would be that God could not allow anyone to think freely. Since everyone thinks and no one thinks only pure thoughts, God would be pretty busy and we wouldn't be able to think. Anyway, at what point do we stop, at the murder level, stealing level, lying level, or thinking level? As your questions implies, if you want God to stop evil, you would have to be consistent and want Him to do it everywhere all the time, not just pick and choose. It wouldn't work.
Evil is in this world partly because we give it its place but ultimately because God, in His sovereignty, permits it and keeps it under His control.
Then you might say, "Couldn't He just make us perfect and that way we wouldn't sin?" He already did that. He made a perfect angel, Satan, but he sinned. He made a perfect man, Adam, and he sinned. He made a perfect woman, Eve, and she sinned. God knows what He is doing. He made us the way we are for a purpose. We don't fully understand that purpose, but He does.
God is sovereign; He has the right to do as He wishes. He has the right to permit evil for accomplishing His ultimate will. How can He do that? Simple, look at the cross. It was by evil means that men lied and crucified Jesus. Yet God in His infinite wisdom used this evil for good. It was on the cross that Jesus bore our sins in His body (1 Peter. 2:24) and it is because of the cross that we can have forgiveness of sins.
Consider the biblical example of Joseph in the Old Testament. He was sold into slavery by his brothers. Though they meant it for evil, God meant it for good (Gen. 50:20). God is so great that nothing happens without His permission, and in that permission His ultimate plan unfolds. In His plan He is able to use for good what man intends for evil. God is in control.

[*Weird addiction*]

COME ON KID. ARE YOU SERIOUS? UGH do you know who made the bible. PEOPLE LIKE YOU AND ME! thats who. eh. Jesus didnt make it himself, did he now? Therfore, that is not fullproof that Jesus said that.
I'm sorry but all of you hardcore christians seem like pawns in a game of chess. You believe what the church tells you, but you do not know what god himself says.

OMFG thank u! u just spoke my mind!! *claps claps* way to go girl!!

[CrimsonArchangel]

What about those who actually want to work to go to Heaven? What about those who live a virtuous life to go to Heaven? What about those who just live a virtuous life and don't care about Heaven and Hell? They don't have a say. They don't have a choice because the choice is ALREADY made: believe and the reward is Heaven.

Correct me if I am wrong, but this sounded like you think that those that believe in God stop being morally right and do good deeds and what not, thinking that just by believing they are saved (per se). That, IMO, is very selfish. Yes, it is as simple as just believing, but that doesn't mean that Christians don't work and do good deeds. Sure, a person wants to work to go to heaven. Why not believe, then keep on happily being a morally just person? By believing one does not have to stop being morally just.

Wait. Do those who have never heard of God still go to Hell if they remain ignorant about God all their life?

No, no. Not at all. I believe that God has not come back yet for that same reason. He is waiting for every single soul on this planet to at least have heard about God. Now, those people that hear about him for the first time have a choice like everyone else, to either follow or not follow. At least they would have heard about God and his message.

If believing in Jesus is all it takes to get into Heaven, then I might as well live a life of decadence and, at the end of it, seek God's forgiveness...

Again, it seems like you're seeing this the simplistic and easy way out... correct me if I'm wrong.
Lets say that there is a morally just person that does all kinds of good deeds, but that person does not believe in God. Why would he/she then worry about heaven if he/she doesn't even believe it exists? Any morally just person can go to heaven if they accept God. Again, that does not mean that he/she will stop being a moral person. On the contrary, I believe God can make a person be a far more moral person that he/she was before.

Of course, there are the exception of those hardcore, overzealous Christians that even creep me out.

[sadolakced acid]

the key is accepting god...
why is that nessicary?
good people don't always accept god...
is it thier just punishment to burn him hell, along with people who deserve it?
are they equal to the murderers?
is that just?

[ryfitaDF]

the key is accepting god...
why is that nessicary?
good people don't always accept god...
is it thier just punishment to burn him hell, along with people who deserve it?
are they equal to the murderers?
is that just?

exactly. i'm a perfect example of this. i'm nicer than any christian i know, but i'm still damned.

[Spirited Away]

Again, it seems like you're seeing this the simplistic and easy way out... correct me if I'm wrong.
Lets say that there is a morally just person that does all kinds of good deeds, but that person does not believe in God. Why would he/she then worry about heaven if he/she doesn't even believe it exists?
Of course, there are the exception of those hardcore, overzealous Christians that even creep me out.

Yes, I am feeling that is what people (the Bible thumpers) are trying to tell me. Just stop what I'm doing and pray to God and "believe", and voila, Heaven's doors will open to me. I mean, that's all it takes right? Belief? Faith?

Any morally just person can go to heaven if they accept God. Again, that does not mean that he/she will stop being a moral person. On the contrary, I believe God can make a person be a far more moral person that he/she was before.

Well, any immoral person can go to Heaven as well so long as they seek God's forgiveness?

And also, if God is so forgiving, then why won't He forgives those who do not believe in Him and allow them in Heaven?

[HelloSunshine]

I'm Christian, and I completely don't believe that. God loves every single person in the world, and accepts your religion. When you were born He gave you a choice. And that choice is forever yours. I think that if you live a good life, even if you're not Christian, you can still go to heaven, it's not bad to be a different relgion. It's just the way people are.

Why were Adam and Eve sinful? I know the story of Satan disguised as a snake to tempt Eve, but tell me why and how they could sin when they were so perfect?

Because God gave them a CHOICE

[KissMe2408]

Uninspiredfae-----lol, first of all, it's ok if you don't agree with me . I'm not trying to force you in any way to believe in God. And no, i was not offended by your quotes. I'm sorry if christians have treated you so horribly in the past This might sound kind of weird, but i really do enjoy your posts, even tho we have different beliefs i hold nothing against you as a person Now, i will again try to answer some more of your questions

What about those who actually want to work to go to Heaven? What about those who live a virtuous life to go to Heaven? What about those who just live a virtuous life and don't care about Heaven and Hell? They don't have a say. They don't have a choice because the choice is ALREADY made: believe and the reward is Heaven.

Those who want to live a virtuous life, by all means go ahead!! I think it's great when people just want to live right...with no strings attached. Those people never cease to amaze me. But, the thing is...all humans are supposed to go to hell, because of our sins. But God gave us access to heaven...he sacrificied and GAVE us that option of heaven! in the first place, we weren't even supposed to have that option! The choice is not already made, the choice is ours. The beauty of that choice is that you don't have to work to get to heaven. That's the whole point! The thing is...people shouldn't just believe in God, JUST so they can get to heaven and escape hell. It should be because their heart truly wants to follow god and they want to be with Him forever and serve him, instead of trying to do things their own way.

Wait. Do those who have never heard of God still go to Hell if they remain ignorant about God all their life?

The only way to heaven, is to accept Jesus in your heart and believe he is the One true God. If a person has never heard or accepted Jesus then they will not be in heaven...That is why christians are always seem so firm on their religion...they need everyone to hear, and everyone to understand....believing it is the persons choice...but our job as christians is atleast to tell people about Jesus

Yes, God gave free will and wants a person to believe on their own free will. However, do you know that free will is something limitless? When God gave Man that gift of free will, God gave Man poison.

A scenerio:
I do drugs. My Father loves me, I hate him as most druggies hate the people who keep them from their "happiness". However, my Father wants me to quit so he decides on two possible things to do: to love me unconditionally and help me fight against my addiction, or to love me unconditionally and let me do as I like until I learn of the consequences on my own.

The first outcome is simple. He loves me unconditionally and helps me, though I fight him, he still loves me and do not let me go until I suceed against the evils of drug use. It's possible that I still hate him because if it wasn't for the fact that he left me to fend for myself, I wouldn't even have fallen into such a state. Though, because my father loves me unconditionally, he still loves despite my hate and do not let me go on my own. I still have a choice now to love or hate him, but it matters not because he won't let me hurt myself.

The second outcome can easily be imagine as it happens to all who cannot let go of their addiction. I die. He loves me but he thinks that I can work things out on my own. Not to say that I cannot, but I am not as perfect as my Father. I am not as wise as he and thus I am PRONE to make mistakes. My Father loves me, but he will not interfere with my choice to continue doing drugs.

Now then to tie this back with our discusion, substitue the drug for disbelief, substitute "Father" for "God", and think of dying as going to Hell. In which example is God loving and is doing what's good for me? And in which example is God loving but allows me to walk the path of suffering?

In my walk with God, neither of those outcomes are true. It's more of a mix of them. I know he loves me unconditionally, and i know that he knows my every move before i make them, he knows my entire life, and he will be there with me my entire life. Like the first scenario, he trys to lead me down the right path, because he loves me and wants me to have the best. But, I am human lol i make mistakes, and i always tend to wander from this path because other paths look more fun. And it's my choice, so God let's me wander to a new path...but he never leaves my side. I make mistakes and realize that this is not the right path...and he always welcomes me back with open arms. I learn from these mistakes...it makes me stronger in my relationship with God and as a human. If i don't realize my mistake, (which sometimes i dont') then he will put people, or things, or something in my life to help me understand the path i am walking....if i still reject God and say"screw you, i'm doing this myself" then he won't force me or make me come back. But the whole time he is with me, and ready to welcome me back with open arms....i still think that is amazing

Again, what if a person wants to do good? It doesn't matter because they'd go to Hell anyway. If believing in Jesus is all it takes to get into Heaven, then I might as well live a life of decadence and, at the end of it, seek God's forgiveness...I already accept His gift of free will. His gift of free will allows me to live for myself, to think for myself, to believe as free will allow: to believe in anything. I simply believe in disbelief and the consequence is eternal pain. If God loves unconditionally, then why wouldn't he just allow everyone to be in Heaven?

Great question! If god loves unconditionally, why wouldn't he allow everyone to be in heaven? I used to ask this SAME question. And the thing that I learned is that: he DID allow everyone in heaven! in the very beginning, with adam and eve. but the thing is, that us humans screwed it up!...we sinned, and that sin seperated us from God. And that's when we couldn't even get into heaven. But God sacrificed his son...and He TOOK all the blame and all our sins...and then we were aloud to go to heaven because we had no sin...he gave us again, another chance But we have to BELIEVE that God even did that for us, or it's like it didn't even happen! Jesus is the ONLY way to heaven! ...Believing in him and accepting him as your personal lord and savior gets u into heaven, yes...but believing in Him JUST so you can get into heaven, is missing the point!

Again, if God loves unconditionally, then why wouldn't he just allow everyone to be in Heaven? Instead, why must we "believe" to be in Heaven?

lol like i just said up there^...He did allow all of us to get into heaven. but because we sinned, we seperated ourselves from God. But he wanted us with him in heaven! So he gave his only son, to die on the cross for US...and his blood saved us, and he took all the blame and all our sins...and that cleansed us and allowed us back into heaven.

Why were Adam and Eve sinful? I know the story of Satan disguised as a snake to tempt Eve, but tell me why and how they could sin when they were so perfect?

They were perfect They had everything and more. But they still wanted to be more...they wanted to be GOD. Just like Satan...he was an angel first. Did you know that? weird, huh. he was an angel, and he wanted to be more powerful then God...wanted God to bow to him, so he was cast from heaven...and basically satan tried to get adam and eve to think the same way he thought. He knew it would mess up god's creation.That's why they ate the apple...Satan basically said, "if you eat this apple, you will be just like God and have all his powers" They were perfect, until that moment. Sin and human nature messed everything up. And that sin seperated us from God. It tells you the whole story in the bible from beginning to end.

Well, any immoral person can go to Heaven as well so long as they seek God's forgiveness?

Yes! That's the beauty of it! Because whatever sin u have committed, Jesus already payed and took the blame for that sin on the cross!! Accept the fact that he did that, and ask him into your heart as your personal Lord and savior...and ask him for forgiveness

I hope that answered your questions! Of course feel free to post more. And i will try to answer them the best i can!

[JlIaTMK]

OMFG thank u! u just spoke my mind!! *claps claps* way to go girl!!

Thank you :), but I am not a girl haha. Eh, too many misconceptions about my sex.

[Spirited Away]

I'm Christian, and I completely don't believe that. God loves every single person in the world, and accepts your religion. When you were born He gave you a choice. And that choice is forever yours. I think that if you live a good life, even if you're not Christian, you can still go to heaven, it's not bad to be a different relgion. It's just the way people are.
Because God gave them a CHOICE

Please re-read my question and try to answer again.

KissMe, I will fully answer you later... I'm kind of hungry right now.

[avalon*]

God, if She truly exists... probably just doesnt care about us anymore and left...

i mean, how do u explain all this suffering and misery in our world?  if God LOVES us so much, then why does this stuff happen to us...dont give me all that  "God works in mysterious ways" bullshit...give me a clean straight answer

the reason why God allows suffering..well there are a couple of reasons.

1. sin and disobeying - God is a God of justice; He is extremely fair. So that means He needs to punish people who sin. I am Christian, and i sin. Everyone sins; you, me, everyone here. That is a fact. We do things that aren't pleasing to God since He is so perfect. Even though He loves us no matter what happens, He still needs to discipline us. Just like parents; they love you but they still need to punish you sometimes. It's the same way with God. Suffering is one way of punishing those who do not obey God. The tsunami reminds me of Noah's Ark. God flooded the whole land but spared Noah and his family because they obeyed God.

2. to bring people to believe in God - God knows that when we are in a time of suffering, many people naturally turn to God for help. Even nonChristians sometimes pray a quick prayer like "help me God" when they know they are in dire need or danger. So when the world suffers, not everyone depends on God. But some do, and this way people will turn back to God and start obeying Him again because they see how powerful yet forgiving He is.

one more thing..God sent Jesus to die on the cross for our sins. [Christians believe that God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are kind of different entities but they are the same being...just in case you didn't know] so when Jesus died on the cross, he endured the greatest suffering ever. The burdens of all the sins of the world that had been committed and would be committed were on Him. He took the blame for us. [you know this especially if you saw the Passion of the Christ] Would he not go through the most extreme suffering and not know what it feels like when we suffer? He knows what it feels like; he's endured so much more than we could ever imagine.

so basically, God does let people suffer, but He has His reasons. Maybe in the long run we'll see why. we don't understand now, but He knows all things. it's kind of like when you tell someone a joke and they don't get it..you understand it but they don't. they'll understand sooner or later though.

if any of you have more questions, i'll try and help clarify things =] just informing you of these things, you don't have to believe them.

[heyyfrankie]

wait....what is the point of this post?

[iiiiiiiYON]

KOME ON HAWMiES... iiTSZ ALL A MATTER OF FAiTH BELiEVE IN GODDD!! =P

[sadolakced acid]

Glad to see that you're typing in regular text, and that you're supporting your umm... nice... opinion with facts.

[bad_girl]

u make me feel like we're all forced to believe in God. whatever happened to all the other Gods? and God.. is just a matter of belief. no one had truly seen God, or proved there was such a "person". therefore, God remains a mystery on Planet Earth. lol. that sounded really harsh. um. actually, i do believe in God, but i don't believe that he created all of us. i think the fact that chemicals and bacteria were mixed together and created us- human, made more sense to me.

[CrimsonArchangel]

KOME ON HAWMiES... iiTSZ ALL A MATTER OF FAiTH BELiEVE IN GODDD!! =P

If you are serious, get a life. If you're not, then nice try. You seriously give Christians such a bad image...

The thing is...people shouldn't just believe in God, JUST so they can get to heaven and escape hell.

to you. That's what I've been trying to say, heh.

Believing in him and accepting him as your personal lord and savior gets u into heaven, yes...but believing in Him JUST so you can get into heaven, is missing the point!

another . This sort of ties to what I said to Fae and answers this...

Just stop what I'm doing and pray to God and "believe", and voila, Heaven's doors will open to me. I mean, that's all it takes right? Belief? Faith?

Yes, it is as simple as that. But again, just believing to escape hell is the easy and wrong way out.

And yes, God allows any immoral person to go to Heaven when they believe because they (most at least) truly want to change and seek God to do so. Like I've been saying again, and again, how is something you do not believe in going to reward you in some way? Those immoral persons that "get to go to heaven" do so because they believed that God could change them. God is capable of turning any immoral bastard into the most moral and just person on earth. Its that simple.

[Spirited Away]

Yes, it is as simple as that. But again, just believing to escape hell is the easy and wrong way out.
And yes, God allows any immoral person to go to Heaven when they believe because they (most at least) truly want to change and seek God to do so. Like I've been saying again, and again, how is something you do not believe in going to reward you in some way? Those immoral persons that "get to go to heaven" do so because they believed that God could change them. God is capable of turning any immoral bastard into the most moral and just person on earth. Its that simple.

Those who lived in decadence all their lives will be forgiven for their sins and be rewarded once they cry out to God and those who lived with a good heart all their lives will be turned away simply because they do not believe in God.

I see.

Then it all comes down to this, Angel. Those of us who live for living's sake, who are good for goodness's sake, who are strong--or weak as you may see it--for the sake of surviving as logic wills, are ALL living for the wrong purposes. However, a wrong has never been so right as much as this one.

God made Mankind from the image of his own body. Made us perfect, but not so perfect as the high perfect Satan, who has almost as much power over us as God. Made us strong, yet weaker than the Evil that we are supposed to fight off.

God is the highest perfection but He must give His only Son to save Mankind from our own sins. Even though He is the most perfect, the all powerful, He still HAD to give away His Son to get rid of our sins. If ever a more contradictory logic exist, I would like to know.

God gave Man free will. The choice to choose Him or be banished to the pits of Hell for eternity. The choices given are not those one would give to someone they love. If I love someone so unconditionally as to forgive them for a lifetime of evil doings, I expand that love and not care as to what choice he/she makes, I would still protect him/her even after death. But this God gave Man two choices, one of pure bliss and one of pure poison. Would you give poison, as a choice, to someone you love?

I think, the God that the Bible make out to be is not all loving, not all powerful, and certainly not all forgiving. Yes, The God of the Bible is surely powerful and loving and forgiving, but He cannot represent the highest epitome of those traits.

[sadolakced acid]

i was told that although hitler was dispicible and killed a lot of people, that because he was christian that if when he died he truley was sorry for what he did, he would have gottne to go to heaven.

on the contrast, all the jews he had killed would have gone to hell because they didn't belive jesus was god.

[avalon*]

u make me feel like we're all forced to believe in God. whatever happened to all the other Gods? and God.. is just a matter of belief. no one had truly seen God, or proved there was such a "person". therefore, God remains a mystery on Planet Earth. lol. that sounded really harsh. um. actually, i do believe in God, but i don't believe that he created all of us. i think the fact that chemicals and bacteria were mixed together and created us- human, made more sense to me.

i'm sorry if you feel like you're being forced to believe in God. it really is your choice =) if people are forcing you, then they're misrepresenting Christians. our goal is to try to help you along the way if you feel like you want to believe in God or need some help with it. we are here to encourage you to believe whatever you like, but keep in mind that our belief is that whoever doesn't have a relationship with God will go to hell. we don't want to mean that in a harsh way, but that is the truth [or at least our truth]. the reason we tell people that is because they are our friends and family and we don't want to see them go to hell. we want them to experience eternal paradise in heaven =)

i agree, sometimes it is hard to believe in God because you don't see Him, but when i look at all the good things He's doing in my life, how can i not believe? =) but then, some people will ask how there are good things when there is so much suffering? for the answer to that, look at my recent post from yesterday =)

i hope you will not hold anything against Christians because of how some Christians have acted around you

[Teesa]

the key is accepting god...
why is that nessicary?
good people don't always accept god...
is it thier just punishment to burn him hell, along with people who deserve it?
are they equal to the murderers?
is that just?

I know..why do I automatically go to hell, if i don't believe in god? I haven't done anything wrong, I'm not a bad person.

//edit//

i'm sorry if you feel like you're being forced to believe in God. it really is your choice =) if people are forcing you, then they're misrepresenting Christians. our goal is to try to help you along the way if you feel like you want to believe in God or need some help with it. we are here to encourage you to believe whatever you like, but keep in mind that our belief is that whoever doesn't have a relationship with God will go to hell. we don't want to mean that in a harsh way, but that is the truth [or at least our truth]. the reason we tell people that is because they are our friends and family and we don't want to see them go to hell. we want them to experience eternal paradise in heaven =)

i agree, sometimes it is hard to believe in God because you don't see Him, but when i look at all the good things He's doing in my life, how can i not believe? =) but then, some people will ask how there are good things when there is so much suffering? for the answer to that, look at my recent post from yesterday =)

i hope you will not hold anything against Christians because of how some Christians have acted around you 

all the good things in your life? see, thats the thing with a lot of christians, is that whatever good things that happen to them, they say that god answered their prayers and whatnot, but what if it was a result from something else? like hard work or something? people just need something to believe in, and when something good happens, it was because of god.

1. sin and disobeying - God is a God of justice; He is extremely fair. So that means He needs to punish people who sin. I am Christian, and i sin. Everyone sins; you, me, everyone here. That is a fact. We do things that aren't pleasing to God since He is so perfect. Even though He loves us no matter what happens, He still needs to discipline us. Just like parents; they love you but they still need to punish you sometimes. It's the same way with God. Suffering is one way of punishing those who do not obey God. The tsunami reminds me of Noah's Ark. God flooded the whole land but spared Noah and his family because they obeyed God.

wait, god put the tsunami there to punish people? to punish people for their sins? what about the babies, what about the little children? i'm sorry, i just don't understand it.

[avalon*]

I know..why do I automatically go to hell, if i don't believe in god? I haven't done anything wrong, I'm not a bad person.

//edit//

all the good things in your life? see, thats the thing with a lot of christians, is that whatever good things that happen to them, they say that god answered their prayers and whatnot, but what if it was a result from something else? like hard work or something? people just need something to believe in, and when something good happens, it was because of god.

these are really good questions..and i'll try my best to answer them =)

1. well christians believe that only people who believe in God will go to heaven. if you don't believe it, that's okay; that is your decision, but it doesn't change that fact. [sorry if i sound harsh, i'm trying to explain it as best as i can ] it's kind of hard to explain..God says that the only way to get to heaven is through Him, but some people think there's many ways to get to heaven. we consider their belief wrong, but we still try and respect them and their belief.

2. because i believe in God and try my best to obey him, he blesses me with good things in my life. but we don't lead perfect lives either; we're just like anyone else. the only difference is that we have a relationship with God. if it was a result from something else, i know that God helped me along the way because He loves me and wants the best for me. just like if you got an A and your friend helped you study a little, and you said "i'm so happy i got an A!", it wouldn't be completely true because your friend helped you..so it'd be more like "i got an A and my friend helped" [even though i say that sometimes..haha yes we all make mistakes =)]

you're right; humans do need something to believe in. we were created with a desire for something more. some people have found it, and others haven't. i have chosen to find it in God. maybe you've chosen something else; we're all different. that's a fact. God knows that lots of people don't believe in Him, and it makes Him really sad because he is the one who created us. just like if you ran away from home, your parents would probably be really sad and would want to search for you. our job as christians is to bring you back home if you want to -- we can't force you..some people think forcing beliefs is the best way, but i think that we should let people choose to "go home", not be forced, because then that shows that you really are willing to do it.

feel free to ask any more questions you have =)

[espionage]

Argh... for the 1000000th time I'm explaining this...

Person becomes Christian. Person becomes TRUE Christian. Person loves God so much that he wishes to please God. Person becomes morally better because he loves God. The End.

Read. Please regard my word, "BETTER". Now you can critisize me. =[