It's official Options

[razbus]

I dont know about everyone else, but i am really pissed about bush being re-elected. I dont even feel like typing all the bad things i said on my blog. If you want to read it.... here.

[*tweeak*]

um, yeah? im still undecided. its getting a bit patheric actually, but if they "took half of what kerry say and half of what bush says and put them together, they would be the perfect president" as someone or other said

[HolyMolyRavioli]

I agree with you on the electoral college system. It's really a pain in the arse.

Grrr. I'm angry like you... I... Ugh. I don't even know what to say.

[*kryogenix*]

America has a bright future.

4 more years.

[Mr. Psychotic]

America has a bright future.

4 more years.

I second that statement!

[inlonelinessidie]

America has a bright future.

4 more years.

A bright future of losing more jobs, a greater deficit, more war, oh and yes losing more allies to help us with the mess that we are in. Indeed a bright future . . . indeed.

[*kryogenix*]

A bright future of losing more jobs, a greater deficit, more war, oh and yes losing more allies to help us with the mess that we are in. Indeed a bright future . . . indeed.

It's not Bush's fault that there is a deficit. But that's a different arguement. What mess are you talking about? As for the allies, do we want allies that stab us in the back ? (referring to the UN oil for food scandal)

It's people like you who are dividing the United States. We need to be united, just as we were before the Democratic primaries.

[ghjgfkgfk]

i would rather have bush win rather then kerry.

it's funny, because it would only matter who won in ohio.

[Spirited Away]

A bright future of losing more jobs

That's ^^ the only thing I want to address for now.

Losing more jobs? To be more specific, I think you mean outsourcing, i.e off-shoring. Can you explain to me why you understand this to be a bad thing?

No, I'm not asking you to tell me the generic response that everyone else seems to be saying, like how our jobs are being shipped overseas... etc. I want you to let me know in details, such as the KINDS (manufacturing or services) of jobs that we're suposedly losing to cheap labor in foreign countries. If you can, I'd appreciate names of companies that are moving overseas as well.

Do you think that the only thing we can trade is capital? What about trading labor? They, capital and labor, are essentially needed to produce any good and services.

Also, I would like to ask if anyone who believes outsourcing is bad, know anything of something called "globalization" and how that can be accomplished through TRADE. Or if you guys have ever heard of something called comparative vs absolute advantage.

If anyone's wondering, yes I am trying to prove a point.

I'll begin with this: it is a fundamental knowledge in economics that there are ALWAYS winners and losers in trade. However, winning and losing also depend on the most important factor of all, TIME, as in short run and long run.

[sadolakced acid]

why is it not bush's fault that there is a national defict?

there was an actual surplus at the end of the clinton admin. it wasn't an economy in recession, but an economy ready to go into recession. bush could have stopped it, if he had the skill and had paid attention to it.

when i ask people to tell me why we're in iraq, they say that sadamm had helped osama, or he deserved to be removed.

can i remind you that your 'man with morals' told america that he was attacking sadamn it was because he 'had' weapons of mass destruction?

may i remind you that our leader with a 'clear and steady plan' shifted the reason for the war in iraq when it became apparent no WMDs were going to be found?

might i remind you that sadamm could not have hit us if he did have WMDs?

could i remind you that osama tried to unseat sadamm?

[Teesa]

i am so angry and sad at the same time..i feel ur pain razbus.

[muffin dude 292]

I am not angry I actually wanted bush to win.

[metabolic666]

I'm only a tad bit disapointed but oh well 4 more yers of the retarted guy

[sunissed14127]

i am very pissed. I think he's a liar & a racist pig and if it was leagal i would-o never mind i dont wanna offend any one. well i wrote basicaly most of the things u kno/think about bush in the what are some good things about bush or w/e it was called.in my opinion i think he has killed our country.

[*kryogenix*]

why is it not bush's fault that there is a national defict?

there was an actual surplus at the end of the clinton admin. it wasn't an economy in recession, but an economy ready to go into recession. bush could have stopped it, if he had the skill and had paid attention to it.

how could Bush had stopped it? he wasn't in office until January. The recession started in November.

when i ask people to tell me why we're in iraq, they say that sadamm had helped osama, or he deserved to be removed. 

can i remind you that your 'man with morals'  told america that he was attacking sadamn it was because he 'had' weapons of mass destruction? 

may i remind you that our leader with a 'clear and steady plan'  shifted the reason for the war in iraq when it became apparent no WMDs were going to be found? 

might i remind you that sadamm could not have hit us if he did have WMDs? 

How is this Bush's fault? 3 top intelligence agencies said yes, there were WMDs.

could i remind you that osama tried to unseat sadamm?

Source? The 9/11 commission report even said there was contact between Iraq and Al Qaeda. Also, Iraq harbored terrorists that were wounded in Afghanistan.

I'm only a tad bit disapointed but oh well 4 more yers of the retarted guy

Spell retarded correctly before insulting our President's intelligence. Plus, wasn't there some study that said Bush was smarter than John Kerry?

  i am very pissed. I think he's a liar & a racist pig and if it was leagal i would-o never mind i dont wanna offend any one. well i wrote basicaly most of the things u kno/think about bush in the what are some good things about bush or w/e it was called.in my opinion i think he has killed our country.

Pure slander. Can you back up these statements with facts? No. And I could barely understand what you are trying to say anyway.

[Spirited Away]

*taps foot*, I'm still waiting for someone, anyone to answer my previous questions about your dislike of Bush because the country is seemingly losing jobs to foreign countries.

[highly_evolved]

. . . . . . man i dont get it, weve all seen wat hes done, weve heard him talk, weve heard him make up words, and yet...still people re-elect him? o ya, wait he legalized guns, thats kool i dont mind a 6 year old buying a gun. whats the harm in that?

[*kryogenix*]

. . . . . . man i dont get it, weve all seen wat hes done, weve heard him talk, weve heard him make up words, and yet...still people re-elect him? o ya, wait he legalized guns, thats kool i dont mind a 6 year old buying a gun. whats the harm in that?

The right to own guns is in the constitution. What are you babbling on about?

[highly_evolved]

The right to own guns is in the constitution. What are you babbling on about?

course its in the constitution but theres gotta be limits. do you WANT 6 year old buying a gun? do you seriously not care?

[ComradeRed]

A STATE can pass limits on gun ownership.

The Federal Government is LEGALLY PROHIBITED from passing gun laws. Law is the most important thing in a country. A country without laws must be either an anarchy or a dictatorship.

---

But there is reason to believe that Bush's second term will be much better than his first:

1) He will not pander to evangelicals and base voters so much. As Tim Russert noted, "Bush's first term was for the voters, his second is for history." Bush will want to be remembered well, and I think that the best way he can do this is by reigning in Social Security, Medicare, and the Tax System. Now that Bush has won a second term, there will be no doubt that he will go down in history, for better or worse, as one of our most influential presidents. The same goes for Kerry.

2) The reason behind this is because, the three most important events in our political history: The ratification of the Constitutiion (1789), the start of the Civil War (1861), and FDR's New Deal (1933) all happened 72 years apart. It seems that every 72 years, a politician (Washington, Lincoln, FDR) makes an earth-shaking change that CHANGES OUR REPUBLIC FOREVER. For example, the period from 1789 to 1861 is widely called Constitutional, because the government followed the Constitution, between 1861 and 1933 is corporate, because the government primarily followed the interests of big business, and from 1933 on as socialist, where the government primarily focused on enlargening itself.

Now if this trend holds, then 2005 will be the start of the Fourth Era, and Bush will be the one who starts it. He will do something in 2005--circumstance will force it--which may lead to restoring our Constitutional liberties, and the total destruction or at least reform of many of hte programs such as Social Seucirty and Medicare that are bankrupting our country.

Either that or he'll lead us into a fascist dictatorship.

3) Neoconservatism is turning out of vogue. The failure in Iraq has convinced many in the Republican Party that their brief experiement with neocosnervativism ought never be repeated. Exit polls after the election show that, while over 80% of the voters perfer Bush to handle the War on Terror, fewer than 30% perfer him to handle the War in Iraq. Even Francis Fukuyama, the founder of neoconservative thought, has dismissed the war as an abject failure which has not led to democratization, and has only created more terrorists--as much as I disagree with him on many issues, he is right about that. In this sense, the war was a valuable learning experience for hte Republican Party, much as Vietnam was a valuable learning experience for the Democratic Party to mind our own business.


I supported Kerry (Badnarik was my first choice), but just because Bush has been elected does not make this the end of hte world.

[highly_evolved]

I supported Kerry (Badnarik was my first choice), but just because Bush has been elected does not make this the end of hte world.

it sure will make one hell of a difference though.

[razbus]

Okay, here is the bottom line:

1. Bush is forcing HIS FCUKING RELIGION on the rest of america!

Just answer me this... someone... anyone. What possible reason could anyone have to outlaw same-sex marriage? Hm? Think of one LOGICAL reason that has nothing to do with religion. Anything. And don't say morals because the word "morals" in every sense is directly related to christianity.

2. Bush is combining church and state!

Okay, WHAT CHURCH? His church! Not mine. Why should i pray in school, or be forced to say "one nation under God"??? Not my nation. Not my god. Not my president.

3. Abortion

Im not going to even touch this subject. ... er, well, let me just say that until the umbilical chord is cut, technically it is still a part of the womans body. *cough* viva la choice.

4. Shipping jobs overseas

Shipping jobs overseas is fine with me. ::gasp:: BUT, when the reason you are doing it is so that you can pay some little Hungarian kid 50 cents an hour... that's wrong. Do it for knowledge, do it to full fill quotas. But not to save money and avoid minimum wage laws.

Well, thats all i have to say. I finally got all that shit off my chest. If anyone cares to reply... PLEASE DO. I await your excuses.

[*Weird addiction*]

i feel sooo dissapointed,i wanted kerry to win,bush is no good,THANK god im not american coz ill be soooooo pissed!!

[Spirited Away]

Okay, here is the bottom line:

1. Bush is forcing HIS FCUKING RELIGION on the rest of america!

Just answer me this... someone... anyone. What possible reason could anyone have to outlaw same-sex marriage? Hm? Think of one LOGICAL reason that has nothing to do with religion. Anything. And don't say morals because the word "morals" in every sense is directly related to christianity.

I'm as Agnostic as can be and I don't feel like he's forcing religion down my throat. How come same-sex activists understand that on the road of freedom and equality there will some setbacks, but you can't seem to comprehend that?

I'm a moral person my dear, but I've never once considered myself to be Christian. Without religion, ONLY morality upholds what is right in society. Without religon AND morals, there's no point in marriage--what homosexuals are fighting for--AT ALL.

Morality in Christianity is different from morality that has existed way before any religion. Try not to group them together. If you want to know why they're different, let me know.

I'm currently against homosexual marriages. But like I've said MANY times in these debates, changes this drastic need time for everyone to adjust. Morally minded people do not like to see people in love not being able to married, but it takes time to adjust to the fact that those people are of the same sex. Though you may think that this is backward way of thinking, that is how the human mind works. Period. Change needs time.

2. Bush is combining church and state!

Okay, WHAT CHURCH? His church! Not mine. Why should i pray in school, or be forced to say "one nation under God"??? Not my nation. Not my god. Not my president.

He many not your President, but he's mine, and so was Clinton and so were Presidents that preceeded him.

Are you forced to pray to the Christian God in school? Are you forced to say the pledge? It has been a while since I'm in educational facilities that have pledges in the mornings, but I remember NOT being forced to cite it, ever. People will look you weird if you do not, but since when do you HAVE to say "under God"? Since when do you have to cite the WHOLE enchilada? Is someone going to throw you in jail for not saying "under God"? If they do, let me know and I and many others will help raise money for a lawyer for you.

3. Abortion

Im not going to even touch this subject. ... er, well, let me just say that until the umbilical chord is cut, technically it is still a part of the womans body. *cough* viva la choice.

Choice indeed, but what about the baby's choice?

I'm pro-choice, but I still consider the morality of killing something that will become a baby. Sure, you can say that contraceptions prevent making babies, but note that I said the KILLING of something that will become a baby. Preventing it and killing it are two different things.

4. Shipping jobs overseas

Shipping jobs overseas is fine with me. ::gasp:: BUT, when the reason you are doing it is so that you can pay some little Hungarian kid 50 cents an hour... that's wrong. Do it for knowledge, do it to full fill quotas. But not to save money and avoid minimum wage laws.

Uh, yea. That's shows how much you know about exchange rates. 50 cents to them means more than it means to us. Their minimun wage law is different than ours. But how are you so sure that they get paid 50 cents an hour by American businesses?

But to move on to my point:

The Labor Code of 1992 states that children may only be employed when they have finished their compulsory education, which effectively sets the minimum age for work at 16 years.[2158] However, children who are at least 14 years old are permitted to work if the work does not interfere with schooling or if they are exempt from attending school.[2159] All children under age 16 must obtain the consent of a legal guardian before entering into an employment contract.

The above is quoted from the Bureau of International labor affairs about Hungary's child labor laws. That should give you peace of mind about child labor there.

There are of course, children who works as beggars and in discreet sweatshops (if there are any), but doesn't that happen in every country?

Do you think that outsourcing is not regulated to ensure fairness in payment?

Well, thats all i have to say. I finally got all that shit off my chest. If anyone cares to reply... PLEASE DO. I await your excuses.

Is that how you debate? By saying what others will say "excuses"? Shows how mature you are.

[sunissed14127]

Pure slander. Can you back up these statements with facts? No. And I could barely understand what you are trying to say anyway.

fine u want facts:

what i was saying about him being racist: Has he done anything for the black,hispanic,asian,and other communities? no! and in my local newspaper,it said this about immigration:"Favors a new temporary worker program to match willing workers with willing U.S. employers when no Americans can be found to fill the jobs.The program would be open to aliens currently employed in the United States." that is going to cut down jobs for immigrants. Immigrants have families they need to support too!

And what i mean about him killing our country: He has turned all countries against us,excepy the saudi's. and did you know that bush sold 7% of the USA to the saudi's? so if they get pissed at us,they will most likely use that 7% of the country against us,because they can do whatever they want with it.he has screwed us over,and if Bush pissed any country off,they could come over here and start killing innocent people with a snap of a finger.


And if you need more,i can go on about Bush all day long.