Is the Confederate Flag Racist? Options

[ComradeRed]

Since the FCC was made

And the FCC is unconstitutional. What's your point?

Furthermore, the FCC oly controls public domain broadcast. They cant controk private speech, including cable.

It's also revealing that your only argument is that we should do something because Amerika's equivalent of the Gestapo Thought Police said so.

[EmeraldKnight]

if the person who displays the flag is doing it with racist intentions, it is racist. period. therefore the argument about what the south stood for our whatever does not matter much. 

Dude, read the previous posts..

Thank you Minda for the following:

The six major changes in the CSA Constitution are:

- Slavery
- Purposes of Congressional spending limited --> MUCH less corruption in the CSA Congress than the USA Congress
- Abolishing riders on bills --> We DESPERATELY need this
- Supermajority to approve spending --> We desperately need this too
- Line-item veto (I oppose this BTW)
- One-Term Limit for President

Five of the six changes have nothing to do with race... hence only 1/6 racism.

There are five slavery-related articles in the CSA Constitution. Of these, THREE DIRECTLY ATTACK THE INSTITUTION OF SLAVERY (by prohibiting the importation of new slaves, by restricting slavery in the territories, etc), one is neutral in content, and one protects the property rights of slaveholders.

In other words, even if the South DID win the Civil War, the institution of slavery itself was to meet a somewhat slower, but inevitable economic demise. At the same time, we would all enjoy liberties to a much greater extent than we do now.

If I had a time machine to go back to the Civil War, and knowing the unconstitutional future of America with a Union victory, I would unquestionably have supported the Confederacy. If the CSA Constitution were in force today, we would have a balanced budget, no horrendous abuse of civil liberties like patriot, no FDR-style mini-dictatorships, much lower taxes, less spending, and less war.

Now I know that was really controversial, but onenonlyone... I'm sure you support NOT being bigoted... so I think that to be fair, everyone should actually read the Confederate Constitution before passing judgment on what side was actually right in the Civil War. Remember that before Lincoln brought slavery to the forefront in 1863, the entire world looked at the North as a tyrannical power, and the South as an oppressed minority seeking only to be left alone.

What is the FCC? Am I supposed to know that?

[T00000]

Dude, read the previous posts..

I have read the previous posts, maybe you should read the previous posts to see where i said it before and i still stand by it, IF the displayer who displays it is doing it with racist intentions, it is racist. Furthurmore, if this is an argument over what the flag stands for, it is impossible. Minda gave six different views the confederate consitution held, and any one of those are legit. So is the condederate flag racist? Not entirely. However, 1/6 or whatever IS racist. Also, it may be considered racist by many and most individuals, because we were all brought up learning that the civil war was about slavery. Whether is was about slavery or not doesn't concern many, because it's a longstanding "understanding," while perhaps misguided, that the South fought for slavery. So according to those odds, I would say that while the flag itself may not be entirely racist, it is at least part racist, and most people consider it racist unless they are civil war scholars, so therefore many who display it do so with racist intentions, and used in that way, the flag is racist.


PS: let's not call me 'dude' again

[EmeraldKnight]

I have read the previous posts, maybe you should read the previous posts to see where i said it before and i still stand by it, IF the displayer who displays it is doing it with racist intentions, it is racist.

That's ONLY if they do it with racist intentions.. you can't just generalize and say that the flag is racist in all cases

Not entirely. However, 1/6 or whatever IS racist. Also, it may be considered racist by many and most individuals, because we were all brought up learning that the civil war was about slavery. Whether is was about slavery or not doesn't concern many, because it's a longstanding "understanding," while perhaps misguided, that the South fought for slavery. So according to those odds, I would say that while the flag itself may not be entirely racist, it is at least part racist, and most people consider it racist unless they are civil war scholars, so therefore many who display it do so with racist intentions, and used in that way, the flag is racist. So according to those odds, I would say that while the flag itself may not be entirely racist, it is at least part racist, and most people consider it racist unless they are civil war scholars, so therefore many who display it do so with racist intentions, and used in that way, the flag is racist.

I think this goes along with an old topic "the importance of truth"; so basically what you're saying is that because most people view the flag as racist and onli see the slavery aspect of the Civil War, the flag is thus racist because most everyone sees it as such?

PS: let's not call me 'dude' again

Sorrie.. habit of sorts.. my apologies

[onenonly101]

Me

since you are using the word based. Afirmative Action is not based on race. You could say race being a factor is racist or sex being a facotr is sexiest or being disabled and so on.

Minda

Then it's also sexist, etc. Your argument is like saying Nazism was not anti-semitic cause it didnt deal only with jews

^^That is from the affirmative action debate. If you think that affirmative action is racist then so is the flag, because eventhough affirmative action does not just deal with race ya'll still say it is racist. So eventhough the flag doesn't just deal with race it doesn't mean it isn't racist.

[T00000]

^^That is from the affirmative action debate. If you think that affirmative action is racist then so is the flag, because eventhough affirmative action does not just deal with race ya'll still say it is racist. So eventhough the flag doesn't just deal with race it doesn't mean it isn't racist.

I couldn't have said it better myself

[*CrackedRearView*]

ComradeRed --

I noticed you talked about the CNFL...

Are you going to be doing any policy debating this season?

I've done Lincoln-Douglas a few times, but policy is my thing.

[ComradeRed]

The flag doesn't deal with racism, however. People can interpret it as such. The flag itself is just a piece of cloth. Affirmative action is a policy actually based on race. Moreover, even if you argue that the Confederate Constitution was racist--which I will agree too, since it does protect "negro slavery"--the flag itself is therefore a symbol of racism, not racism in and of itself.

The words "affirmative action" are not racist-- the policy is.

I do LD at NCFL and Congress at NFL.

[onenonly101]

But flags are made to represent someone, represent an idea. The Confederacy and the Constituion as you said were racist and the flag is to represent the Confederacy and its ideas, so then the flag would be racist

[Nashvixen]

Once again, I didn't read replies...but here's mine!
I don't think that the Confederate flag was "racist" at the time, because people didn't go around wearing it on their T-shirts.
I have a Confederate flag on a shirt of mine, but I wear it as a symbol of my heritage, not a viewpoint (that I don't possess). I'm Southern and proud.
However, the Confederate flag has been turned into a racist symbol in my situations. I don't agree with that.

[nevernothere]

It's not racist as long as you don't flaunt it... this kid at my school has this giant Confederate flag mounted on his pickup... and I live in ILLINOIS.

[Spirited Away]

Once again, I didn't read replies...but here's mine!
I don't think that the Confederate flag was "racist" at the time, because people didn't go around wearing it on their T-shirts.
I have a Confederate flag on a shirt of mine, but I wear it as a symbol of my heritage, not a viewpoint (that I don't possess). I'm Southern and proud.
However, the Confederate flag has been turned into a racist symbol in my situations. I don't agree with that.

Hi,

I know you're trying to be cute and all, but try to read previous posts and also provide a reason as to why you don't agree with something. You are in the debate forum after all, and the rules are clear. Thank you.

On a side note, I didn't know people sell Confederate flag T-shirts.

[sammi rules you]

why do we keep bringing back extremely old topics?!

[sadolakced acid]

because the ressurection is drawing near.

:-P

ok that was corny... oh well.

[fameONE]

I'm a northerner, born and raised. When I moved to Texas, I was given a hard time for being the 'yankee.'

Today, I asked a few kids (classified as 'hicks') what the flag meant to them and they said the obvious; heritage, history, etc. Well, when I asked them to elaborate on what that heritage actually was, I didn't get nice responses at all. One kid even mumbled something about me being black under his breath. Instead of me demonstrating what a right hook to the temple can do, it further solidified my claim to the rebel flag and ignorance.

If I hadn't lived amidst these red flags everyday and someone explained to me in a stoic manner what exactly they believed the flag meant, and none of it had to do with prejudice or bigotry, then I'd probably drop the subject. But for all of you who just think that it stands for history as well, you are sadly mistakened if you're a minority living amongst the 'Good Ol Boys' (as they like to be called).

[DavidJ2318]

i say no, well not anymore anyway.

i am from the south (but not white) and id say no, i mean it doesnt signify racism like it used to, now its just a part of southern culture and heritage even if did once have a negative connotation

[heyyfrankie]

some people at my school think it is like a racisism symbol for blacks and people from the north. i just think it is a flag that was once used for the south. =/

[skateforfree]

i mite be from texas but i think the confederate flag has alot of racism invovled with it

[antix10_kos]

The confederate flag is offensive. Or at least I think so. I used to live a racist, backwoods part of the country where non-whites were looked down upon. I was spit on, had things put in my hair, was pushed, had things stolen and was called racist names like spic and squaw almost every day. Racism sucks and so does any symbol of racism, including the confederate flag. I don't care who says what about a person's right to display such items. It still hurts to see it, to see people wearing it, waving it around, and acting like I'm supposed to forgive and forget. F*ck that. It's like waving a Nazi flag and saying "I don't care that the people that celebrated this flag killed millions of Jews and other human beings that they thought inferior." Every time I see a Confederate flag waving around, I think " That person doesn't care that millions of people were enslaved, tortured and killed under that flag."

As for flying, or wearing it out of honor of dead relatives, that is your choice, but I believe that those people died defending a cause that was outrageous and ludicrous and nothing but selfish and greedy. No good reasons to die for.....

[PinoyOtaku]

The Confederate Flag is part of history... it should be regarded as that, not as something racist.

Amen on that! To those whom think it's racist...try living in Northern Idaho...though it seems to be a looong ways out from the "Deep South", you'd be seeing Confederate flags there... One of the staff in my school is a redneck (along with most of the other staff...not implying anything negative here ) and seemed to be proud to wave that Confederate flag along with the Stars and Stripes. Was he racist? Well...if he was then my stay there would've been pretty rough...but he wasn't. He was one of the staff I'd actually get along with and pretty much told me in more detail of what our ComradeRed said. It's those that take it to the level of racism and those that believe that it's a racist symbol that keeps this stereotype alive.

[fameONE]

Amen on that! To those whom think it's racist...try living in Northern Idaho...though it seems to be a looong ways out from the "Deep South", you'd be seeing Confederate flags there... One of the staff in my school is a redneck (along with most of the other staff...not implying anything negative here ) and seemed to be proud to wave that Confederate flag along with the Stars and Stripes. Was he racist? Well...if he was then my stay there would've been pretty rough...but he wasn't. He was one of the staff I'd actually get along with and pretty much told me in more detail of what our ComradeRed said. It's those that take it to the level of racism and those that believe that it's a racist symbol that keeps this stereotype alive.

Re-read antix10_kos's reply and suck on it for a while, then read and respond to mine.

I don't live in Northern Idaho, I live in the suburbs of San Antonio, Texas. Oh yea, its one of the largest cities in the country, but there's a convenience store 3 miles from my house that will shut down business if someone of color walks through the doors. Guess what's painted on top of the building and guess what's flying alongside of the American flag? You guessed it, genius, the confederate flag.

Keep in mind that I'm not bashing on everyone who sports it because most do not understand the gravity of such an icon. Maybe to you and where you're from it doesn't hold that sort of symbolism, but to me (as well as my friends who aren't white) its the equivalent of a swastika. My point being that the most of the kids at school get this pride from their parents. Their parents see someone black and are quicker to say, "nigger," they see someone gay and the first thing they blurt out is, "queer," or, "fag," and so on with other minorities.

Racism and bigotry is everywhere, but it seems to be bit stronger among the wavers of stars and bars (most, not all). It stands for history and heritage all right, it stands for the history of lynched black folks and a heritage of ignorance.

[PinoyOtaku]

Re-read antix10_kos's reply and suck on it for a while, then read and respond to mine.

Sorry I missed it at first, just got a bit too roudy after reading the first few replies... Due to my ignorance and lack of reading this thread thoroughly, I failed to take note anti's post. I have no intention of trying to cover up his experiences or his opinions...unfortunately due to my idiotic impatience I replied without looking throughly at the replies of this thread. I didn't take other people's experiences into consideration and only took the only one I had and I apologize for that. Again I apologize for my ignorance and narrow-minded behavior and please forgive me for that. As usual I need to get my facts straight on this before getting all charismatic, excited, etc. and be a bit more patient...

[Nashvixen]

Hi,

I know you're trying to be cute and all,  but try to read previous posts and also provide a reason as to why you don't agree with something. You are in the debate forum after all, and the rules are clear. Thank you.

On a side note, I didn't know people sell Confederate flag T-shirts.

Don't assume that I'm trying to be cute; I find it rude, seeing as I was being serious.
Yes, people do sell T-shirts with Confederate flags on them.
I read the debate, just not every friggin reply...don't fret.

[Spirited Away]

Don't assume that I'm trying to be cute; I find it rude, seeing as I was being serious.
Yes, people do sell T-shirts with Confederate flags on them.
I read the debate, just not every friggin reply...don't fret.

I didn't assume anything, it was sarcasm. In other words, to be as blunt and to be as easy to understand as possible, I was patronizing you. You wound me by assuming I was making an assumption on your character.

Now then, the following is purely speculation from what you said in those two posts. I found it rude that you would disregard the rules for this forum and post whatever you feel like without reading everyone else's previous reponse. And not to mention, you were quite proud of what you were doing. That showed you don't follow directions well and that you have a lack of regard for propriety.

So, who's the rude one first?

The rules also ask that you provide a reason, based on facts (or good logic), if you happen to take a side. You didn't do that.

Sorry, but I had to "fret". I was a mod even then and we try to enforce the rules as much as possible. Thanks.

If you have a complaint/suggestion/concern towards staff, please head here:
http://www.createblog.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=73264

And as always, respect our rules, and we'll respect you.

[lilliannnn]

i think it is.. i don't have a very strong opinion to write or anything, but yeah i think it's deffinitly racist.