Jesus... gay?? Options

[Trau]

I'm Jewish, so there may be something about Christianity I don't know. How was Jesus different?

If he was a good Jew, he would continue his bloodline. That's the first step to it, and there's no skipping over that. 'Sources' say he was a good jew, from a Jewish family. Is that incorrect?

If I am right, and Jesus was a good jew, then no matter what you say, I won't believe that he didn't create a family.

Jesus wasn't a good Jew as far as Jews are concerned. He wasn't a good Jew as far as the temple leaders of the time were concerned. You and I might have a different idea of what a "good Jew" is or was at that time.

And let's not forget that Jesus was hardly a typical Jew; he caused a shitstorm within his religion that lead to his own death and the birth of Christianity.

As far as this business of Jesus being gay, the absence of commentary on his sexuality in the Bible is hardly evidence to conclude that he was indeed homosexual. Seeing as members of humanity are disproportionately heterosexual we can only reasonably assume that he was within that 90-95 percent of the population. And that's just looking at Jesus as a man. If you believe he was the son of God, then you are indeed a silly person to suggest he could have been homosexual.

[gr00vyswordsman]

Considering these cultural and historical facts, it's surprising Scripture has so few references to homosexual acts. What's not surprising is that these references always condemn homosexual behavior.

But Scripture never condemns homosexual behavior by itself. It is condemned when practicing idolatry or sacred prostitution. It is condemned when promoting promiscuity. It is condemned when forcing violent rape or seducing children. And it is condemned when violating a guests' right to dignity as a male.

Also, Scriptural references only speak of homosexual acts - not homosexual people. Not until the Revised Standard Version of the Bible (revised from the King James version in 1885) do we find references to homosexuals themselves. These occur in translating the Greek words "malakoi" and "arsenokoitai" in Paul's letters.

Never is the issue of homosexual behavior between loving, homosexual partners addressed in Scripture. The reason is simple: biblical cultures did not have knowledge of homosexuality as a psychological identity. In biblical times homosexuality was known only by the acts people committed, not as a sexual personality. A person born heterosexual assumed homosexual acts to be something people did for dominance or in perversion of their inner identity.

Scripture and Homosexuality

[gr00vyswordsman]

The New Testament also emphasized resurrection, which led to belief in personal immortality. Survival beyond the grave no longer was associated with bearing children.

Different sexual lifestyles entered the new covenant with God. Sexual abstinence and celibate communities became common expressions of Christian living.

In the Act of the Apostles, 8:26-39, we see the first time the Holy Spirit recruits members to the new covenant from the sexual outcasts of Israel. The Spirit leads Philip to encounter the Ethiopian eunuch, who is baptized into the Christian community. The Lucan author of this account is showing how the Holy Spirit formed the first Christian community. He emphasizes the fact that outcasts were included in the new covenant with God. First he tells of including the Samaritans. Then the Ethiopian eunuch was welcomed to the covenant.

The New Testament was written in Greek. At the time, Hebrew, Greek, and the translation between them used the term eunuch two ways: literally, meaning the castrated; and symbolically, meaning those who do not marry and/or bear children.

Jesus was the first to recognize sexual outcasts as worthy of God's kingdom. He and his disciples were discussing marriage and divorce in Matthew 19:12 when he said: "All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it." [footnote 7]

This quote from Matthew is the closest biblical reference we have to our current understanding that homosexuality is a psychological identity, rather than just physical acts. For Christ to have known this in biblical times is a testament to his inspired understanding.

Jesus brought a new covenant with God, not only to the children of Israel but to all mankind. It is a covenant of loving your neighbor as yourself, and raising a joyful noise unto the Lord. The communities established by his disciples, who knew and quoted him, accepted all the outcasts of Israel and understood the Genesis account of sex as the gift of companionship as well as procreation.

This fulfills the prophecy of the Messiah. In Isaiah 56: 2-8, the eunuch is predicted to inherit a special place in the house of the Lord and the sons of strangers are predicted to take hold of the Lord's covenant. Verse 7 predicts: "Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people."

[Trau]

No one is arguing that homosexuals cannot be saved.

However, there is no evidence that the "sexual outcasts" you speak of continued their deviant behavior. The Bible only speaks of a legitimate relationship being between a man and his wife, never are same sex couples included in this. Therefore it is not necessary to point out that homosexual behavior is only condemned for some people and not others.

[Ington]

Chill out Ermfernoo...it wasn't an excute to be ignorant...simply saying excuse me if i was wrong duh.....and btw......you dont know, what you dont know ^_^.


I think on the next Mortal Kombat game....jesus should be in it :)
that would be rAD....

Apologies, you may have misread that. I wasn't saying you're ignorant, I meant that if people are agnostic, they shouldn't use that as an excuse for not knowing somehting. I didn't mean it towards you specifically.

[gr00vyswordsman]

ah, ok...

[gr00vyswordsman]

laaaaadiiiidaaa....weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.........

[Ington]

Excuse me, don't spam.

To prevent this from being spam;

Jesus could have been gay. Of course, then, it wouldn't be considered being gay.

[lollypop036]

wtf??? jesus gay??? of course he's not lol, try reading the bible, its against the 10 commandments and all!! and..he's jesus for cryin out loud! plus i dunno if this he's true but some say he had a wife right?? so how could he possibly be gay?

[sexthybeans]

you know, the bible doesn't seem to mention him being homosexual or heterosexual. have you people considered that Jesus didn't have those kind of feelings for anyone? that he was asexual? (meaning that he didn't have desire for sex, not that he didn't have sex organs) but then again, who really knows?

and about the issue of all the disciples being men, things were really sexually biased in those days. sure, it would have been better if Jesus said he were a fisherman of people, but that's how it was. it was a man's world.

lastly, the DaVinci Code is FICTION. it is based on the book Holy Blood, Holy Grail, which is only a theory about Jesus' sexuality and relations.

[Joss-eh-lime]

Can you guys tell me where the Bible states that homosexuality is a sin or "warns against being gay"? I'm just a little confused.
Fact by faith is not completely fact. If I have faith that the sky is red, does that mean the sky is red? I think it's a "fact" by default.

its true, faith is not the same as fact but my view on this topic is based on the bible, not facts, or other people opinions.
how come people dont do their research. the bible talks about homosexual acts many times
-in Genisis there is the passage about Sodom & Gomorrah
-in Leviticus it simply says those one have sex with the same gender "have commited an abomination"

You dont have to believe what the bible says, but it says it.

[alishaminter]

[font=Arial][font=Arial Black][size=6][font=Arial Black][size=3]Ok I just joined this site so I haven't read the whole debate but from what I have read alot of you ask for facts but why would it be called faith if we always had to have facts.No I don't believe Jesus was gay simply because it is a sin.I know the Bible doesnt mention that he was not gay but what we have to realize is that God sent his only son for one purpose and one purpose ony not to start relationships or to even think about it because from what i have read thinking about it is even a sin.But unlike us,Jesus was perfect therefore there wasnt even the thought of another man in a romantical way.I also do not believe Jesus and Mary M. had a thing.If Jesus had just cast 7 demons out of me I would follow him around prasing God also.

[*yrrnotelekktric*]

.....did jesus even exist?

[colleen92]

i'm sorry.

but just because someone has morals doesn't mean they're gay.

[Spirited Away]

its true, faith is not the same as fact but my view on this topic is based on the bible, not facts, or other people opinions.
how come people dont do their research. the bible talks about homosexual acts many times
-in Genisis there is the passage about Sodom & Gomorrah
-in Leviticus it simply says those one have sex with the same gender "have commited an abomination"

You dont have to believe what the bible says, but it says it.

If you were pointing out that I have not done research, I'd like to clarify why I was "confused" in the first place. The passage you've cited clearly defines sodomy (anal sex) as sin, but what of attraction to the same sex? Does the Bible condemn love between man and man or does it condemn sex between man and man?

If you had continue reading, I posed this question:

I have a question...

Does the Bible condemn the act of homosexuality or does it condemn homosexuality? I've heard of the saying "hate the sin, but love the sinner" and thought that the sin is sodomy, and homosexuals themselves would be spared of condemnation. Yes, there are homosexuals who choose to live a life of abstinence.

Apparently, I had done research and found myself stuck with that quandary. Would you like to explain what the Bible says about that?

And for your information, Jewish literature explains that God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah not because of their citizens' sexual orientation, but because they were sinful in character--lack of philanthropy and greed.

[*yrrnotelekktric*]

i'm sorry.

but just because someone has morals doesn't mean they're gay.

seriously people.

[Kontroll]

Nowhere in the Bible does it state that he is homosexual. Nowhere in the Bible does it state that he is heterosexual. I think it's safe to assume he was heterosexual since it seems homosexuality is condemned... And even so, I don't think it matters. God doesn't partake in relationships.

Actually God does partake in relationships. Why do you think he created us? He wants a personal relationship with us. He loves us. Why would He love his creation and not want a relationship? Secondly, you have to look at it this way. The Trinity is more of a relationship. You have the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. All three are apart of one being. Think of it as offices that are held. He is a triune God which makes relationships possible. Before his creation there was only God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. God was involved in a relationship before us.

If you think about it, if you have a god like Allah, it is really impossible that he created us. He is a monad, which means that there is only one being and that is Allah. He never had a relationship before the creation and to change that would make him inconsistent and therefore fallible.

Secondly, I'd like to say that the DiVinci Code is just a work of fiction. Most of the stuff they talk about, is based on a belief that is anti Christian. If you have seen specials on TV they talk about the books that never made it in the Bible. Well, it's for good reason. They were inconsistent with the message of the Bible. They were also written hundreds of years later. The Bible states that no book should be added or taken away unless these people have has special revelation from God. These books were just an attack of the Christian faith. And DiVinci code is showing that. Jesus was single. Are you going to trust a book that was written by the inspiration of God, or a fallible, imperfect person?


To Spirited Away... Yes, homosexuals can be spared of condemnation. It would seem that this is a Catholic view, but according to the Bible it says that we cannot be saved accept by faith in Jesus. Even heterosexuals are condemned. It's not the acts that condemn a person, but the relation they don't have with Jesus. Homosexuality, period is wrong according to the Bible. I understand where you are coming from with the whole 'ACT' of homosexuality being wrong or just in general. Well, the thing is, is that you have to look deeper. I'm guessing you used the English version, which is sometimes different from the original translations. Some of the words are different cause we don't have words that match up with the Greek and Hebrew languages. So, I would say to start out there.

My friend believes that in Genesis, there is no mention of Satan. True there is no mention if 'Satan' in that name, but Satan was the serpent in the Garden. You can see this through the translations.

Okay, I'm done being an apologetic for now. peace.

[Spirited Away]

To Spirited Away... Yes, homosexuals can be spared of condemnation. It would seem that this is a Catholic view, but according to the Bible it says that we cannot be saved accept by faith in Jesus. Even heterosexuals are condemned. It's not the acts that condemn a person, but the relation they don't have with Jesus. Homosexuality, period is wrong according to the Bible. I understand where you are coming from with the whole 'ACT' of homosexuality being wrong or just in general. Well, the thing is, is that you have to look deeper. I'm guessing you used the English version, which is sometimes different from the original translations. Some of the words are different cause we don't have words that match up with the Greek and Hebrew languages. So, I would say to start out there.

I read that there was no word for homosexuality specifically in the Bible but the term used is sodomy and the phrase "man lies with man" (or close to it). To me, that's a strong case against sodomy, but not love or attraction. Is there a passage that I'm missing about love between man and man is sinful? You say that the Bible states that homosexuality is wrong in general, which I suppose means that love in their case is sinful as well, but is there a passage that I can read? I just haven't run across it myself.

Intercourse does not replace true intimacy and a number of homosexuals choose abstinence because they are God-fearing. I don't see why these people would still be in the wrong (unless the Bible is specific about it, though I haven't read any thing very... specific)

I'm not sure how much deeper I should look for the answer.

[*Uronacid*]

You cannot "prove" whether Jesus was gay or not if you don't believe in the Christiain religion.

But if you are a christian:

1. God=Infalible
2. God=Perfect
3. God=Doesn't Change
4. God said, "Homosexuality is a Sin" (I can find scripture if you want)
5. Jesus=God (He is part of the Trinity)
6. Jesus=Perfect
7. Jesus=DOESN'T SIN
8. Jusus=NOT GAY

but if you aren't a Christian... this won't mean anything

[Spirited Away]

4. God said, "Homosexuality is a Sin" (I can find scripture if you want)

As I've asked in the post just above yours, will you find me the passage where the actual word "homosexuality" is labeled sinful? Again, I'm curious if being gay is sinful or if sodomy is the real sin.

[*Uronacid*]

If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them (Leviticus 20:13).

You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination (Leviticus 18:22).

Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due' (Romans 1:26,27).

It doesn't say they goto hell tho... :/

[Spirited Away]

If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them (Leviticus 20:13).

You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination (Leviticus 18:22).

Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due' (Romans 1:26,27).
It doesn't say they goto hell tho... :/

Out of the passages, the only one close to what I was asking for was one that stated men who "burned in their lust for one another... is shameful". The others, as I've said before, they are a strong case against SODOMY and not the love/attraction part of homosexuality. Again, intercourse, or the lust for it, does not replace true intimacy.

I'm not asking if they'd go to Hell or not, I'm just asking if it'd still be considered sinful or if they are condemned by the Bible for LOVE alone.

And again, I still have not seen the actual word "homosexuality" in any of those passages, just words/phrases describing the actions thereof.

[ktsou11]

I don't think so. The Bible says that homosexuality is a sin and since Jesus was perfect and without sin, then He couldn't have been.

Praise God!

[Spirited Away]

I don't think so. The Bible says that homosexuality is a sin and since Jesus was perfect and without sin, then He couldn't have been.

Praise God!

... Read one post above yours.

[gr00vyswordsman]

iguess we'll each find out the truth one by one.....as we die we'll find out truth to all. Lol