school uniforms Options

[demolished]

uniform will be good w/ different colors and different products.

people at my school, they wear clothes that make them look all bad. i cant tell wether he/she is a good person.

i have a friend that is nice but looks all bad and mean.

[can0_reo]

My school has uniforms, sometimes i don't like it. but it helps in that, you don't need to get new stuff every year or month or watever. Some ppl even wear the same shirt and pants everyday, lol. My school was newly built and the rules have change since the beginning... the uniform policy is less strict, but we have to keep the same colors.
I think its alright, two more years to go... They should have days were we can wear whateva we want like on fridays or something...

[*Zyryll*]

i personally laugh at kids with school uniforms... hehe. nawww, just kidding.

well... it kind of sucks for you people who have to wear it. you gave up your freedom of clothes, and that's a sacred freedom... everyone would agree on me that everyone needs to wear they're own clothes that reflects among themselves, no matter if it's eplict in anyway.

plus, the opposite sex would find you more attractive so.. *ka ching ka ching*. no one can complain about that!!!

hehe.. well, that's just what i think.

[HazyEyes]

I say...no uniforms....We need to give people their space to express themselves...even if they are children...Oh and if you give people in elementary school uniforms because they copy eachother anyway...what is that teaching them? What about when they go to highschool? They would probably think it's good for everyone to look the same....

[Spirited Away]

I say...no uniforms....We need to give people their space to express themselves...even if they are children...Oh and if you give people in elementary school uniforms because they copy eachother anyway...what is that teaching them? What about when they go to highschool? They would probably think it's good for everyone to look the same....

read the thread. This argument has been said so many times, it got boring 10 pages back.

If the only way someone, a child even, can express his/her 'individuality' is through clothes, then there's not much 'individuality' to speak of. Everyone is his/her own person with different ideas and preferences. Uniforms are not going to stop that in anyway, in fact, uniforms may enhance the need to discover more ways for self-expression.

Imagine with me a blind person. Is being blind going to stop him/her from exploring their other senses? No, of course not. They are going to use their sense of touch, smell, hearing and taste to 'see' the world. Likewise, wearing a uniform is not going to stop anyone from self-expression. People will find other ways to be creative. If they cannot, well, creativity is just not their calling, not God-given, not something they were born with it... etc. Just don't blame it on the uniforms. That's weak.

[Im So Vain]

/wow this topic is old/I wish my school had uniforms. Only because of the simple fact that it takes me forever to find something nice to wear to school. If we had uniforms picking clothes would be one less thing to worry about. And I would be able to save all my nice clothes for when I go out on the weekend, because no one would have seen it yet.

[*RockizLife*]

Here's my opinion on the subject. I've been wearing a uniform to school going on three years now. Now, I'll admit, I don't like them, however, I do think they are a good idea. Saves a lot of time and money. And to you people saying clothing is a way to express yourself, yeah, I agree to an extent. But if that's what you need to express yourself, that's pathetic. At my school it never ceases to amaze me how every single kid is visibly unique despite the fact we are all wearing nearly the same thing. (Our dress code has color variations, and of course girls wear skirts and guys wear pants, lol.) If your expression is limited to your clothing, you're just a poser.

Now, do I think all schools should have them? Of course not. I think it does take away a lot of freedom and some expression, however it prevents a lot of issues that schools have to deal with everyday. I think that choice is up to the school board and students.

no. its a form of self expression. clothing comes in such a variety that you can just tell a person`s personality by what they wear. whats next. piercings to show who you are?

Wow, that's shallow. So you mean I should think that goth kid over there in the dark corner with black lipstick and black eyeliner is a depressed freak, or the polo shirt wearing jock is a jerk? Please. If we all thought that way, we'd all be a bunch of shallow lonely people. Some "goth" kids I know are the nicest people I've ever met, and same with some jocks.

[dancerellie714]

^i agree that uniforms shouldnt be in school.

sure a dress code to make sure people dont come to school in stripper outfits and stuff is fine...but why should a school system have the power to tell you that t-shirts are now unexceptable and only collared shirts are allowed? is school really that big of a dictatorship that we now have to be told what to wear? who gives them the power to say that? the bigger question here is...is a school uniform stifling the right to freedom of expression...our constitutional right (in the US at least...)?

[Spirited Away]

^i agree that uniforms shouldnt be in school.

sure a dress code to make sure people dont come to school in stripper outfits and stuff is fine...but why should a school system have the power to tell you that t-shirts are now unexceptable and only collared shirts are allowed? is school really that big of a dictatorship that we now have to be told what to wear? who gives them the power to say that? the bigger question here is...is a school uniform stifling the right to freedom of expression...our constitutional right (in the US at least...)?

You'd call that a dictatorship. Kids exaggerate everything nowadays.

Anyway, let me tell you something, it's called following the rules and we all have follow rules some time in our very mortal life. There are adults who go to work in uniforms; I do and millions of others do it, too. We don't work under a dictator—though my co-workers may disagree—we simply follow company policy. Why? It pays and we look pretty professional. Dictator? No. You can always choose another job, or in our case, you can always move to another school.

[sadolakced acid]

^ in school, students are considered the 'patrons' and teachers the 'servers'

if rules of every other service industry are applied to schools, teachers would wear uniforms and students would wear shoes and shirts.

does McDonald force it's customers to wear a uniform? no.

fae, don't forget that move to another school isn't technically and option.

it's like handcuffing someone to a pole and saying they're free to go because they can chop off thier hand.

moving to another school district means actually selling your house and moving, where changing a job involves a two weeks notice.

[Spirited Away]

^  in school, students are considered the 'patrons' and teachers the 'servers'

Back to this again huh Mr Acid? Ah old times. LOL, I'll indulge you.

Teachers don't make uniform policies, states, school districts, and the board of education and the PTA play the biggest roles of all in the making of that kind of policy. On that same scale, students are NOT patrons, they are daughters and sons, and students. That's it.

if rules of every other service industry are applied to schools, teachers would wear uniforms and students would wear shoes and shirts. does McDonald force it's customers to wear a uniform?  no.

No, rules of service industries cannot be applied to schools in this case. You can choose to buy a McDonald burger, you you don't have a choice in going to school; state law requires school attendence. Thus, they cannot be compared.

fae, don't forget that move to another school isn't technically and option. 

Yes, it is. If you and your parents, who are and SHOULD BE the true decision makers in your family, have problems with such a policy, moving to another neighborhood with a different school zone is very possible. Inconvenient, but if uniforms are such a hinderous thing to the child's creativity, I'm sure parents wouldn't mind dealing with it.

it's like handcuffing someone to a pole and saying they're free to go because they can chop off thier hand.

No, it's saying you're free to go to the next pole that doesn't have handcuffs if you really up to it. Don't be lazy.

moving to another school district means actually selling your house and moving, where changing a job involves a two weeks notice.

Again, one of the many inconveniences that adults must deal with when they have kids. If it's such a big deal, they could very well move out of the country if they have to.

I've moved 6-7 times and each to a different school and three times to a new district. Five of those times, my parents were able to keep the same job. Two weeks notices are not necessary.

From what I'm getting, kids are usually the ones to complain. But you must always remember, kids complain about homework, teachers who smell, and when they do something silly in front of their crushes. You get the idea.

[sadolakced acid]

sell your house and moving isn't a viable option.

simply going to another school, if so allowed by the discrict, would be a viable option.

a home and school are tied together. you don't change schools. you change houses, and the school changes with that.

so it can't be compared to jobs.

with students, a school is nothing. a school, fundamentally, exists only to serve the students

state law not only requires you to go to school, it requires you to go to the school in which your house is zoned.

it's like if i took over the country and required all churches to be burned. if anyone complained, i could say "just move out of the country then". is that exactly fair?

and sure, uniforms don't kill your individuality. but they do reduce it. If you don't want to worry about what to wear, no need for uniforms, just by 3 sets of the same clothes and wear that all the time.

[Paradox of Life]

no. its a form of self expression. clothing comes in such a variety that you can just tell a person`s personality by what they wear. whats next. piercings to show who you are?

... You show who you are by how you act. If people are judging you by how you dress, that's called a STEREOTYPE. Do you want to be stereotyped or judged by what you wear? Uniforms are fine by me. But wearing your own clothes doesn't hurt either.

[Spirited Away]

sell your house and moving isn't a viable option. 
simply going to another school, if so allowed by the discrict, would be a viable option.
a home and school are tied together.  you don't change schools.  you change houses, and the school changes with that. 
so it can't be compared to jobs.

It is completely viable if it causes that much of harm to a child. Again, I went to several different school and couple of district before and I have dealt with zoning. I know ALL about it. It's not convenient, but if it's necessary to the family's well-being, then moving is unavoidable. What I am saying is simple. Don't have a cow; they're just uniforms.

with students, a school is nothing.  a school, fundamentally, exists only to serve the students
state law not only requires you to go to school, it requires you to go to the school in which your house is zoned. 
it's like if i took over the country and required all churches to be burned.  if anyone complained, i could say "just move out of the country then".  is that exactly fair?
and sure, uniforms don't kill your individuality.  but they do reduce it.  If you don't want to worry about what to wear, no need for uniforms, just by 3 sets of the same clothes and wear that all the time.

Now this is funny. Students go to school, school don't go to students. If you were to ask me which is more important, students or schools, I would answer by asking you to name me a civilized society without some kind of educational institution. In that sense, schools are more important. Without schools, society is nothing.

... Burning churches hurt congregations, faith...etc. But what would donning uniforms hurt? The two are hardly comparable, Mr. Acid.

How would wearing uniforms 'reduce' individuality'? I don't have your face, nor you have mine; we don't think alike. People love to say "everyone is unique". I like to get into the topic of what makes a person unique. If you say clothes make me unique, then I would say that I never knew you to be so superficial. Are you saying that what make me unique is what I wear? I can have a unique fashion sense and still wear uniforms, after all, I wouldn't strut around in a mall in my uniforms.

Also, are you saying that kids who to go schools with uniforms grow up with less sense of individuality than kids who go to schools that allow free dress. If this is so, is there any statistics to back this up? If you don't, then I don't see how anyone can say a kid wearing a uniform is any less of an individual than a kid without uniform.

[sadolakced acid]

^

the reason why service industries and some private schools and teams have uniforms is so they're part of a whole.

if you wear medical scrubs (basically thier uniform) people don't think "oh there's person" they thing "oh there's a doctor or nurse".

so a school uniform makes you less a person and more just part of the school.

it's a step towards uniformity (which can't really be denied, i mean look at the word, uniform). complete uniformity would be everyone as clones and exactly the same, which you can say is a complete lack of individuality.

so, although uniforms don't kill individuality, it is a move in the direction of suppresion of individuality.

as far as students being the core of a school, show me a school without students and then i'll concede it. (fish don't count).

and, if a school did not exist fundamentally for students and students first, then who does a school serve?


as far as which is more imporant, the students or the school, well it's the students. put a school on a desert island without students and does anyone learn anything?

put students on a desert island without a school and does anyone learn anything? of course.

it is not an entirely free decision to move to another school district. there are consequences to this action, and so you can't really say a person is free to go to another school. there are restrictions. and these restrictions must be taken into account when offering attending another school as a solution if someone is dissatified with uniforms.

The point of uniforms is to remove individuality, to make a group more uniform, more alike. this is the fundamental purpose, because individuals cause trouble. Someone who dresses in revealing clothes is distracting, but this is because everyone else isn't also dressed in revealing clothes. If, for instance, like in 1984 and all the kids were naked, that's uniformity and no one really cares much about it.

by removing a certain amount of individuality, uniforms make it easier to distinguish who's in the group and who's not. As such, if two schools both had uniforms, fraternizing between the schools would occur much less.

this is, of course, not exactley bad in certain cases. However; in schools, where people are increasingly known by thier Social security number, might be required to wear a student ID, and teachers don't know half thier students, uniformity is certainly not desirable.

[Olive]

a school, fundamentally, exists only to serve the students

I don't see how this is so difficult to understand. A school does NOT serve the students. The teachers - Teach not serve. The school is a building - the purpose: to provide education and enforce discipline. It is not a fashion show as students don't get higher marks by appearance, but willingness to learn.

[*RockizLife*]

^ So, wait. The student's serve the teachers? The teachers DO serve the students. It's part of their job, to TEACH, therefore they serve. Not that most students willingly accept the teachings, but still.

I'd have to agree with Acid on this one.

[Spirited Away]

I'll get back to you later Mr. Acid, I'm short on time.

^ So, wait. The student's serve the teachers? The teachers DO serve the students. It's part of their job, to TEACH, therefore they serve. Not that most students willingly accept the teachings, but still.

I'd have to agree with Acid on this one.

... So from what you're saying, since teachers serve students, they are under a servitude. That means, when a teacher gives you a grade you don't like, you can spit in her face and demand another one. Or when a teacher asks the class to be quiet, the students can yell back "shut up, f**k face" and go on as they like. After all, from your definition, teachers serve students.

Actually, no, teachers don't serve students, teacher teach students but serve parents, society, and schools.

[*RockizLife*]

^ Uh, I believe teaching is offering a service, Fae. A job is a service. That doesn't mean they're slaves or anything. If it was in the case your talking about I very seriously doubt kids would go to school at all. Of course there would be consequences if a student spit in the teachers face, but if a customer spit in a McDonald's workers face, there would still be consequences as well and that worker is still serving the consumer. And from your viewpoint, the teacher can't spit in the students face either. They'd probably get in even more trouble as opposed to a student doing it to them.

[XxVaLeRyXx]

a lot of school have uniforms.But the most of schools are no uniform.

and I agree: NO UNIFORMS!!!!!!

[Spirited Away]

^ Uh, I believe teaching is offering a service, Fae. A job is a service. That doesn't mean they're slaves or anything. If it was in the case your talking about I very seriously doubt kids would go to school at all. Of course there would be consequences if a student spit in the teachers face, but if a customer spit in a McDonald's workers face, there would still be consequences as well and that worker is still serving the consumer. And from your viewpoint, the teacher can't spit in the students face either. They'd probably get in even more trouble as opposed to a student doing it to them. 

Read me again, carefully this time so that you wouldn't think to explain to me what a job is when I've been part of the work force for some time now.

Teachers teach students. Teachers serve schools, parents, society. Do you see the difference? I'm NOT saying that teaching is not a service, I am saying that students are NOT the ones being served (unless they pay for the service, which most don't). It's that simple and that's all I'm trying to say.

In my view point? I think you're a little confused here. It's in your view point that I'm basing my example. Since you are saying that teachers serve students, it's perfectly plausible to say that students can refuse to do homework or demand a better grade, after all, what kind of service would require a patron to do homework and give a bad mark when it's not done correctly? Not the ordinary kind, I tell ya.

Now then, lets get back to topic. Teachers are not the ones requiring kids to wear uniforms.

the reason why service industries and some private schools and teams have uniforms is so they're part of a whole.
if you wear medical scrubs (basically thier uniform) people don't think "oh there's person"  they thing "oh there's a doctor or nurse".
so a school uniform makes you less a person and more just part of the school. 
it's a step towards uniformity (which can't really be denied, i mean look at the word, uniform).  complete uniformity would be everyone as clones and exactly the same, which you can say is a complete lack of individuality.

so, although uniforms don't kill individuality, it is a move in the direction of suppresion of individuality. 

Alright, you still haven't given me the evidence I need from you, so I can't count your argument credible.

I asked that you provide me with some stats about kids' "individuality" being so irrevocably surpressed from wearing uniforms. Seriously, I went to school in Vietnam for a while. If you don't know anything about schooling there, know that uniforms are... well a way of life. My cousins who went through K-12 wear uniforms. What kind of "move in the direction of suppression of individuality" should I notice from them? What kind of move towards a lack of individuality do you notice from me?

Uniforms are not at all like cloning. How can you even put two and two together? Are you saying that when you and I don uniforms, there is no difference between us? That we're all of a sudden clones and my political stance is the same as yours? What if we wear the same uniforms as some Christian kids? All of a sudden we turn Christian? What the heezy?

as far as students being the core of a school, show me a school without students and then i'll concede it.  (fish don't count).
and, if a school did not exist fundamentally for students and students first, then who does a school serve?

And I said show me a civilized society without schools and I'll conceed. Schools fundamentally serve society by educating children for the betterment of communities. There is a sizable difference in serving society and in serving kids. Again, the service is to society, children get the butt (eg. homeworks, projects, attendance) of the deal.

as far as which is more imporant, the students or the school, well it's the students.  put a school on a desert island without students and does anyone learn anything? 
put students on a desert island without a school and does anyone learn anything?  of course. 

Actually, that's false. When you put a group of students on a desert island to fend of for themselves, the students who learned something and pass on the knowledge to another become teachers. Even without a school, there can be teachers. And to your first question, I would ask if you can tell me if the deserted island has a civilized society. But seeing how it's deserted, without civilized society, there shouldn't be a school there in the first place.

it is not an entirely free decision to move to another school district.  there are consequences to this action, and so you can't really say a person is free to go to another school.  there are restrictions.  and these restrictions must be taken into account when offering attending another school as a solution if someone is dissatified with uniforms.

... what kind of consequences are even more important than the happiness and health of the family? If uniforms are ruining a child's mind, then it's imperative that parents make the right choice to move away in order to protect the child. But seeing how there's nothing to prove that uniforms do this kind of damage... well, again, don't have a cow.

The point of uniforms is to remove individuality, to make a group more uniform, more alike.  this is the fundamental purpose, because individuals cause trouble.  Someone who dresses in revealing clothes is distracting, but this is because everyone else isn't also dressed in revealing clothes.   If, for instance, like in 1984 and all the kids were naked, that's uniformity and no one really cares much about it.
by removing a certain amount of individuality, uniforms make it easier to distinguish who's in the group and who's not.  As such, if two schools both had uniforms, fraternizing between the schools would occur much less. 
this is, of course, not exactley bad in certain cases.   However; in schools, where people are increasingly known by thier Social security number, might be required to wear a student ID,   and teachers don't know half thier students, uniformity is certainly not desirable.

The funny thing is we're not talking about 1984 where uniformity is taken to a whole other scale. That's paranoia. Uniforms in schools, not while you sleep, go the mall and certainly not while attending a party.

If you really want to get into it, believe or not children: slacks, ties, black shoes, blazers, dress shirts, otherwise known as typical business suits are a form of uniform for the white collar working class. If these folks' individuality are supressed, it's not from what they're wearing, it's from life.

[OhXiet_ItzDonnA]

no. we gotta look cute SOMETIMES right? But it sucks when u get suspended or whatever just cuz u didnt tuck in ur shirt or whatever

[Spirited Away]

no. we gotta look cute SOMETIMES right? But it sucks when u get suspended or whatever just cuz u didnt tuck in ur shirt or whatever

mall, party, home, gym. there goes "sometimes".

[sadolakced acid]

teachers get paid to teach students, and that's the truth of it.

students are part of society, and they are the part of society that schools serve.


anyways; uniforms are a step in the dierction of total removal of individuality. it's a small step, but even a small one should be avoided.

[Spirited Away]

Aye, they get paid by parents to teach students, not to serve them. There is a difference. Home-schooled kids are not being served by Moms and Dads, they're being taught.

Students are a part of society in which schools serve. Unfortunately, they're not coughing out money to pay the service rendered, thus have no real say in policies.

Uniforms are a step in the direction of removal of individuality IF IT'S MEANT TO BE USED that way. However, it's used towards the direction of:
"decreasing violence and theft -- even life-threatening situations -- among students over designer clothing or expensive sneakers;
helping prevent gang members from wearing gang colors and insignia at school;
instilling students with discipline;
helping parents and students resist peer pressure;
helping students concentrate on their school work; and
helping school officials recognize intruders who come to the school" (source).

If a uniformed child comes home yelling "Mommy, the school is stripping away my individuality! I have no creatvitiy, no thought of self-expression because of these darn uniforms. I'm a clone of Cindy and she stinks!" and such a claim is true, then I have nothing further to say. The point is, such a statement has no truth (except for Cindy being stinky, that I don't know).

If you really want to get into it, believe or not children: slacks, ties, black shoes, blazers, dress shirts, otherwise known as typical business suits are a form of uniform for the white collar working class. If these folks' individuality are supressed, it's not from what they're wearing, it's from life.