Prayer In School, are you against or for prayer in school Options

[chelle]

ok. so i'm doing an english project for school on the oh so controversial topic of prayer in school. and since we LOVE to debate ( ) i was wondering what everyone's stand in this is.

Pro School Prayer Positions:
1)Our Government is based on Religious Principles
2)The Free Exercise Clause Protects School Prayer
3)Banning School Prayer Leads to Moral Decline
4)Majority Should Rule

Anti School Prayer Positions:
1)State-Sponsored School Prayer is Unconstitutional
2)Prayer in School is Already Legal
3)State-Sponsored Prayer Will Lead to Religious Intolerance
4)Moral Decline and School Prayer are Unrelated
TO SEE THESE ARGUMENTS IN DEPTH GO HERE


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i am against school prayer. big surprise. lol. public schools exist to educate, not to proselytize. children in public schools are a captive audience. making prayer an official part of the school day is coercive and invasive. what 5, 8, or 10-year-old could view prayers recited as part of class routine as "voluntary"? religion is private, and schools are public, so it is appropriate that the two should not mix. our schools are for all children, whether catholic, baptist, quaker, atheist, buddhist, wiccan, jewish, agnostic. the schools are supported by all taxpayers, and therefore should be free of religious observances and coercion. when religion has invaded our public school system, it has singled out the lone jewish student, the children in the minority. families who protest state/church violations in our public schools invariably experience persecution. it was common prior to the court decision against school prayer to put non-religious or nonorthodox children in places of detention during bible-reading or prayer recitation. the children of supreme court plaintiffs against religion in schools were beaten up on the way to and from school, their families subjected to community harassment and death threats for speaking out in defense of a constitutional right. we know from history how harmful and destructive religion is in our public schools. individual, silent, personal prayer never has and never could be outlawed in public schools. it is coercive for schools to schedule worship as an official part of the schoo day, school sports or activities, or to use prayer to formalize graduation ceremonies. such prayers are more "mandatory" than "voluntary." the radical school prayer amendment would negate the first amendment's guarantee against government establishment of religion. most distressing, it would be at the expense of the civil rights of children, america's most vulnerable class. it would attack the heart of the bill of rights, which safeguards the rights of the individual from the tyranny of the majority. those in the minority would be compelled to conform to a religion or ritual n which they disbelieve, to suffer the humiliation and imposition of submitting to a daily religious exercise against their will, or be singled out by orthodox classmates and teachers as "heretics" or "sinners" for not participating. should the government become "prayer police"? the school prayer debate seems calculated to deflect attention away from the more pressing economic questions facing our nation. some politicians like to blame everything bad in america upon the absence of school prayer. it is a quick fix. it is irrational to charge that the complicated sociological problems facing our everchanging population stem from lack of prayer in schools. our political system is a democratic republic in which we use majority vote to elect certain officials or pass laws. but, we do not use majority vote to decide what religion, if any, our neighbors must follow. imposing prayer-by-majority-vote is flagrant and insensitive abuse of school authority. such schools should be teaching students about the purpose of the bill of rights, instead of teaching them to be religious bullies.

[*Kathleen*]

Heh I don't have time to read that long paragraph, but I will, but I just don't mind it as long as I'm not forced to. I'm an atheist, too.

[*krnxswat*]

I think having a seperate time just for prayer during school hours is useless, because not everyone follows the same religion. I personally pray before I eat my lunch in school, and it's totally upto the people whether they want to pray or not.

[soadturner]

You might think I might be for it, seeing i go to a Catholic School and dont have a choice to pray

But I say that if you have prayer, have the option to not pray, and allows all relegions to pray....just because Christians are the majority dosent mean we can disrespect the minority

[chelle]

I think having a seperate time just for prayer during school hours is useless, because not everyone follows the same religion. I personally pray before I eat my lunch in school, and it's totally upto the people whether they want to pray or not.

i totally agree.

[CloudUnionX]

It would be nice for some people to have. But what about all the rest that dont follow that religion, or people that dont even beleive in having a religion? I think its useless when you look through all the pros and cons.

[xjjajeengx]

oh we had a debate worth 200 on this before@!!
like we all took a paper and wrote if we were pro or anti, and then like our s.s teacher randomly passed them out.
i chose pro, but i had to debate for the anti side... but i ended up getting 250 points instead of 200 because i was the only one speaking out for the anti side... and my side won MWOOHAHAHA
anwanys, im pro for it. not in the mood for being all like supportive of my details... but okay. haha ^^

[*CEP*]

I say no. Because not everyone's Christian you know? They have Christian/Catholic schools for that.

But I think it's stupid how they tried to take out " under God " from the Pledge of Allegiance. I think that's just stupid.

- Chinkieeyedpnoi

[Dr3aMeR]

I SAY YES. WE NEED PRAYER AT SCHOOLS.

this country was made on the principles of christianity and we should always have stuck my them. sometimes i wish i could go back in time to the Constitutional COnvention of 1787 and make the founding fathers be more specific cause i hate it that people say the constitution says its wrong. "separation of church and state" haha. dumb people who use that as an excuse. the people who made the constituion were christians in one denomination or another...they would have been okay with that fact that there are different types of christianity HOWEVER they would not have been okay with other religions especially taking PRAYER out of SCHOOLS. they might have let the other religions be free to worship on their own but i hardly doubt that they would have wanted prayer out of schools. this country needs to go back to its christian roots.. im tired of people who try to do otherwise

ALSO WHEN they wrote separation of church and state they meant it in the point that the government couldn't stop a form of the Christian denomination. they probably would want them to stop the weird religions that has come into this country.

I mean seriously. if they truly truly wanted separation of church and state and took that literally as some dumb puck holes do now why did they still allow school prayers to go on

dunno know for sure but you ever think of why the Kennedy family has no heir now...ever think about which president was in office when the decision came to stop school prayers...it should make you think

so that is my topic...about the fact what has heppened to the kennedy family in realation cause there is already a topic for school prayer

[noaccounthere]

I say no. Because not everyone's Christian you know? They have Christian/Catholic schools for that.

But I think it's stupid how they tried to take out " under God " from the Pledge of Allegiance. I think that's just stupid.

- Chinkieeyedpnoi

However I believe it is TOTTALLY UNFAIR that my parents taxes go to funding public schools and the government does not fund Private/catholic/christian/jewish/muslim schools out there.

And its a big $7000 tuition every year for me. I believe its unfair that the public school system does not give options to religious studies in school and are basically restricting people optional education to their faith. Notice i said optional.

Also, prayers said effectivly well will only take a minute of class time. In fact thats how it is here in my school it only takes 1 minute to make a short prayer. The prayers are generic that they would fit under all religions. The students would not be obliged to say prayers but just listen silently or choose to ignore if they are athiest. But Its not fair when a majority of our nation is of some form of religous faith to be stripped of the oppertunity to encorporate their faith in their daily lives which they spend most of the time in school because of the rather few non religous persons.

THen again to what i said above. The world isnt fair. And thank you other californians for voting no on that prop. that would allow vouchers to go to parents in private schools. A return of $2000 would've helped alot.

[Just_Dream]

I think having a seperate time just for prayer during school hours is useless, because not everyone follows the same religion. I personally pray before I eat my lunch in school, and it's totally upto the people whether they want to pray or not.

You're really religious, huh?

And also, prayer? What about those people who are NOT Christian or Catholic? I'm Buddhist, and I follow different beliefs. Now, if it was a prayer of a variety of religions, I guess it's okay. Personally, I don't care, because I'm not that much of a religious person. I haven't been to a temple in a while, and I only go once in a while. I've only been to one temple ONCE this year =T

So it wouldn't really mean anything to me. But that's just my opinion

[kevinma03]

"dunno know for sure but you ever think of why the Kennedy family has no heir now...ever think about which president was in office when the decision came to stop school prayers...it should make you think"

Are you implying God had something to do with it?

[Dr3aMeR]

I am not saying that God DID do that because i do not know for sure

what im saying is that yes He could have a part in it...a God that strikes a person dead for lying and cheating will have no problem doing that to someone who took his faith out of schools

[kevinma03]

Um... that would imply God is vengeful. And from what I've learned from Christians, God doesn't kill you, but he will judge you at the day of judgment. Cuz, what happens if I lie and cheat but then repent for my sins through Jesus? If God struck me down before I had the opportunity to repent then that doesn't seem very fair. And as far as I know God is just.

[Dr3aMeR]

The God that struck down a man and woman (husband and wife) dead for lying and cheating were in the old testament days. Don't know the chapter. And see aren't you glad that He gave Jesus to die for us so you have the opportunity to do just that?

[kevinma03]

So that means God shouldn't have anything to do with the Kennedys

[xjjajeengx]

why did you make a new topic for this when all you had to do was post on the prayer post? merging topic.

[Dr3aMeR]

Thats what "predestination" is

some people are saved and some are damned to hell

its a hard concept to grasp because you hear that God is suppose to be just and predistination doesn't seem like it is just. but that is just the way it works...so people that even heard about christianity and had a chance to become Christian..congrats because you had a chance and its up to you if you made the right choice or not

as for the Kennedy's, If God killed them because he wanted to punish and make an example of them so be it. The president was Catholic so they all had their chances to repent and what not. And what is there to say that God can't kill you just because you repent. He might love you so much that He wants you to be with you in heaven right?


xjjajeengx
my bad...but i normally don't read the posts that anyone writes beside for the topic and a few after and the last person to comment anda few before...i mean who cares about the middle...i thought most people did that and no one would read the kenedy thing...and there you butted into my posts, topic again

[xjjajeengx]

uh... just doing my job? sorry...

[kevinma03]

Thats what "predestination" is

some people are saved and some are damned to hell

its a hard concept to grasp because you hear that God is suppose to be just and predistination doesn't seem like it is just. but that is just the way it works...so people that even heard about christianity and had a chance to become Christian..congrats because you had a chance and its up to you if you made the right choice or not

as for the Kennedy's, If God killed them because he wanted to punish and make an example of them so be it. The president was Catholic so they all had their chances to repent and what not. And what is there to say that God can't kill you just because you repent. He might love you so much that He wants you to be with you in heaven right?


xjjajeengx
my bad...but i normally don't read the posts that anyone writes beside for the topic and a few after and the last person to comment anda few before...i mean who cares about the middle...i thought most people did that and no one would read the kenedy thing...and there you butted into my posts, topic again

So people that have not heard about jesus and couldn't repent are going to hell? And to what degree of predestination is there? If God knows every minute movement we are doing now and in the future , then he already knows whether we will be saved or not. That would mean he puts people onto this earth knowing full well they will be damned to hell.

[stryker76]

I am atheist...and a prayer in school im sorry isnt right...there are soo many religions that you have to pray for each one it would talk up soo much time....and teacher always complain there is no time....plus i dont go to school to be preached to if i wanted that i would was my butt up early sunday morning and go to the chrurch down the street...DAMN THERE BELLS!!!!.....But if a school wants to have a prayer then set it aside in a separate room..and liet those that want to go...join

[starling]

I say no. Because not everyone's Christian you know? They have Christian/Catholic schools for that.

not everyone's Christian / Catholic, but no one's saying that if you pray, it has to be a Christian / Catholic prayer. It's up to everyone to decide how they want to pray, or if they even want to. In my school, we had a moment of silence every morning. That way the kids who wanted to pray could, and the kids who didn't want to didn't have to, they could use that time to collect their thoughts or what have you.

However, I feel that there are certain morals and standards from religion that would benefit everyone. "Thou shall not cheat, steal, lie, murder, covet thy neighbor's possessions..."(to paraphrase.) yeah. good things to know. especially in today's society.

This country was founded on certain religious standards. it's says 'In God We Trust" on the money, and every state thanks God or another 'Almighty power' in their constitution. But not one of them says "In the Christian God We Trust." or "In the Jewish God We Trust." It's up to you to decide what you believe in-- I'm not forcing you to pray to my God. But don't take my choice to pray in school away from me.

[kevinma03]

I think that having moments of silence for people that choose to pray can pray is fine. But if the principal hops onto the intercom and starts a Christian prayer then that's going too far.

[xsnowxangelx425]

we have the "moment of silence" in school here.. its supposed to be reflection or prayer time.. I am a christian and a few years ago i probably would have argued that prayer should be in school. However, now that i am older i realize why it isnt. I mean, if we prayed, we'd have to pray to God, mohammed, allah [sp?], and ALL other gods and deitys[sp?] that everyone else in the school belived in. And, the kids who have no religion would be forced to pray when its against what they believe in also. So, i think that the moment of silence is a good thing to have. The ppl that want to pray are allowed and the others can just sit there and continue with their work...

[Dr3aMeR]

Some schools don't even have the moment of silence

And also those people with no religion or not Christian they don't have to participate. they could just sit there and just sit there.