Holocaust |
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 Jul 24 2004, 10:20 PM
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#1
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 Senior Member  Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,025 Joined: Feb 2004 Member No: 4,051  |
There are many many people who think that the holocaust was a hoax and there are also people who think that the americans and the other allies did not help soon enough. what is your opinion on this?
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Jul 24 2004, 10:29 PM
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#2
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Senior Member Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,025 Joined: Feb 2004 Member No: 4,051 |
QUOTE(Arimalka @ Jul 24 2004, 10:24 PM) My grandfather was in a concentration camp. He survived and wrote a journal about his experiences. I've also read a lot of books about the Holocaust, because something about it just fascinates me. How could anyone think something as terrible as that was a hoax? I never heard that theory before. But I definately know it's not true. The Holocaust was real, and it was one of the most horrible events in the history of the world. -Sarah i think the same thing, my grandfathers family was in concentration camps as well but many people that i know, including my 8th grade history teacher believed it was just a publicity hoax |
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Jul 24 2004, 10:35 PM
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#3
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 ㅋㅋㅋ Group: Member Posts: 924 Joined: Jun 2004 Member No: 24,283 |
my family never had to go through that tragedy, but i definitely believe it happened since I did a ton of research on it for 8th, 9th, and 10th grade.
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Jul 24 2004, 11:47 PM
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#4
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i <3 me Group: Member Posts: 315 Joined: Jul 2004 Member No: 30,888 |
who would be cruel enough to make something up like that? i think it's been proven that millions died.
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Jul 25 2004, 01:12 AM
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#5
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 ooo la la Group: Member Posts: 433 Joined: Jun 2004 Member No: 19,853 |
a hoax? is that a joke? the holocaust killed millions of people, its the most real thing out there.
to tell you the truth, i just learn about the holocasut [in 8th grade] and i felt so ignorant not to know about this till 8th grade. i seriously think they should like teach it to kids in 6th grade. |
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Jul 25 2004, 10:40 AM
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#6
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 Kermit the frog = <3 Group: Member Posts: 2,315 Joined: May 2004 Member No: 15,215 |
why would anyone want to make up something so horrid and serious?
that was a horrible past.. we should learn from that and make a better future. |
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Jul 26 2004, 03:12 PM
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#7
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 ^ moo... Group: Member Posts: 962 Joined: Jun 2004 Member No: 25,212 |
a hoax? who the heck thinks that..
and yea the us and allies dint react soon enough, but they didnt know about it and reacted as soon as possible.. :T |
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Jul 26 2004, 04:25 PM
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#8
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 Dark Lord of McCandless Group: Member Posts: 2,226 Joined: May 2004 Member No: 16,761 |
Actually a lot of groups think it's a hoax.
It definitely wasn't a hoax, but as brutal as this may sound -- it was none of our business. If Hitler didn't declare war on us (he did on December 11th, four days after Pearl Harbor -- up until then we were only at war with Japan, not Germany), I would have advocated isolationism back then -- WWII gave FDR many excuses to continue to shore up his power... the fact of the matter is, 5 million people died as a result of American intervention anyway, so even if the Holocaust killed all the remaining Jews in Europe (4.5 million), still more lives would have been saved by America remaining neutral. Furthermore, Stalin was ALREADY WINNING on the Eastern front by the end of 1941. He was building three and a half tanks for every tank Hitler built. By remaining neutral, we would have had a very powerful Germany as a counterweight to Soviet Russia, and thus the Cold War would have been a fight between Hitler and Stalin -- no Arms Race, no MI Complex, no Korea, and no Vietnam -- millions of lives saved. And we would also have saved our Constitution from the ravages of war -- in World War II, we put almost a third as many people into Concentration Camps as Hitler did. |
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Jul 26 2004, 04:35 PM
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#9
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 Quand j'étais jeune... Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 6,826 Joined: Jan 2004 Member No: 1,272 |
QUOTE(ComradeRed @ Jul 26 2004, 4:25 PM) Actually a lot of groups think it's a hoax. It definitely wasn't a hoax, but as brutal as this may sound -- it was none of our business. If Hitler didn't declare war on us (he did on December 11th, four days after Pearl Harbor -- up until then we were only at war with Japan, not Germany), I would have advocated isolationism back then -- WWII gave FDR many excuses to continue to shore up his power... the fact of the matter is, 5 million people died as a result of American intervention anyway, so even if the Holocaust killed all the remaining Jews in Europe (4.5 million), still more lives would have been saved by America remaining neutral. Furthermore, Stalin was ALREADY WINNING on the Eastern front by the end of 1941. He was building three and a half tanks for every tank Hitler built. By remaining neutral, we would have had a very powerful Germany as a counterweight to Soviet Russia, and thus the Cold War would have been a fight between Hitler and Stalin -- no Arms Race, no MI Complex, no Korea, and no Vietnam -- millions of lives saved. And we would also have saved our Constitution from the ravages of war -- in World War II, we put almost a third as many people into Concentration Camps as Hitler did. What do you think would have happened if America kept on with isolationism, aside from the 5 millions lives that would not have been lost due to American intervention? As in, what kind of present/picture can you envision for Europe/America/the world? |
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Jul 26 2004, 04:41 PM
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#10
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Dark Lord of McCandless Group: Member Posts: 2,226 Joined: May 2004 Member No: 16,761 |
Hmm...
I think the world would be much like it is now, only with economic power more concentrated in the Far East than in Europe. Think about it: The Soviet Union collapsed from within. Why? Not because of military might -- because its government became too oppressive and at the same time the leaders became too weak. Nazi Germany and the USSR would have balanced each other out. Eventually they would have to arrive at some sort of peace, at which time the Cold War would begin -- only between the Nazis and Soviets. Eventually, both nations would have collapsed for that reason -- dictatorships never end well. The first dictator is always the strongest, but after that they become weaker and weaker. Hitler would have been replaced by Goering, who quite frankly was an incomptetent fool. Goering eventually would have led to democratic resistance uprisings in France and Italy (in August '43, Southern Italy declared itself independent of the rest of Italy and declared war on Mussolini -- this is a month before the Allies landed in Italy). I could see the collapse of Nazi Germany as early as 1980. It is harder to coordinate a revolution in Russia, so the USSR would probably have lasted until as early as 1985 and as late as 2000. Remember that Gorbachev was a very open minded but weak leader, who basically saw that the USSR could not last and broke it up into the CIS. Under these situations, Russia would be basically the same today as it would be in the alternate history. In fact, the only area that would be significantly different under my alternate history would be Western Europe (France/Germany/Italy), which would likely be economically much weaker, but socially still similar, although Germany might be slightly more repressive than it is today. But still, it wouldn't be our fight. |
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Jul 26 2004, 04:42 PM
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#11
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 who again? Group: Member Posts: 555 Joined: Jul 2004 Member No: 31,458 |
holocaust, no it wasnt a hoax, for many reasons at that. For one, it was an actual even taking place back in the early towards the mid 1900's (quote me if im wrong)
as well as the concentration camps taking place as well as the reformation and acquistion the nazi's were doing towards the jews. Thus, putting them into camps. Holocaust was in fact not a hoax, a horrific and brutal period in time for the jews at that. |
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Mar 18 2005, 10:27 AM
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#12
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 <3 Deanna Leigh Irene <3 Group: Member Posts: 136 Joined: Mar 2005 Member No: 111,326 |
My whole family escaped from Germany right before the holocaust...but yes, a lot of people believe it was a hoax. Other people believe that it was real, but not as many people died as they say did. I believe that they did exagerate (sp?) a little..
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Mar 18 2005, 12:34 PM
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#13
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 Another ditch in the road... you keep moving Group: Member Posts: 6,281 Joined: Jan 2005 Member No: 85,152 |
o fcourse it wasnt a hoax thats ludicrous.
nad the only option the allies had as far as intervention goes would have been to bomb the concentration camps, which is a complex moral dilemna, as the full horrors of the holocaust didnt emerge until after the war, meaning that they would have had no way of knowing exactly the fate of those withn the camps. |
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Mar 18 2005, 01:15 PM
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#14
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 hello : ) Group: Official Member Posts: 4,227 Joined: Apr 2004 Member No: 13,139 |
^Agreed. It's ludicrous to think that the Halocaust is a hoax. People who say that need to learn more about it and get their facts straight and talk to those who have been through the Halocaust. I can't reply about the 2nd half of the question because I don't have nearly enough information to make a decision or not.
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Mar 18 2005, 02:03 PM
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#15
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 crushed. Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 9,432 Joined: Jun 2004 Member No: 20,026 |
I agree with james..I cannot even begin to comprehend how anyone can think that the holocaust was a hoax. I think that they don't want to believe that something so horrible could happen and they're scared to admit to it or something.
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Mar 18 2005, 04:51 PM
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#16
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 WWMD?! - i am from the age of BM 2 Group: Member Posts: 5,308 Joined: Mar 2004 Member No: 8,848 |
oh yea, the holocaust is so not true. cause my great-grandmother is just hiding out, she isn't really dead..
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Mar 19 2005, 02:00 AM
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#17
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 I'll never be who I was again.. Group: Member Posts: 2,886 Joined: Jan 2005 Member No: 77,981 |
QUOTE(Arimalka @ Jul 24 2004, 5:24 PM) My grandfather was in a concentration camp. He survived and wrote a journal about his experiences. I've also read a lot of books about the Holocaust, because something about it just fascinates me. How could anyone think something as terrible as that was a hoax? I never heard that theory before. But I definately know it's not true. The Holocaust was real, and it was one of the most horrible events in the history of the world. -Sarah  i agree...how can ppl think its a hoax?many ppl have suffered b/c of it...ive read a lot of books on the holocaust, and its definately not a hoax...its a really tragic event that occured in history.. |
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Mar 19 2005, 02:30 AM
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#18
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 dripping destruction Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,282 Joined: Jun 2004 Member No: 21,929 |
some people refuse to believe something that horrible could have happened.
or they think it's a political poly or they're on crack. |
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Mar 19 2005, 08:53 AM
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#19
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Another ditch in the road... you keep moving Group: Member Posts: 6,281 Joined: Jan 2005 Member No: 85,152 |
^^
lol. of course, crack doesn't really exist... its just a hoax so people can act all silly. *eyeroll* |
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Mar 19 2005, 12:11 PM
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#20
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 i've never wanted anything rationale. Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 8,449 Joined: May 2004 Member No: 19,045 |
QUOTE(iwalkbackwards @ Mar 18 2005, 8:27 AM) I believe that they did exagerate (sp?) a little.. i don't believe that at all. there were many undocumented deaths, people did not only get killed in concentration camps. and to those people who believe it was a hoax, i just tell them to talk to my Opa and Oma who survived the camps and ask where both of their families disappeared to.... |
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| *xcaitlinx* |
Mar 19 2005, 06:52 PM
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#21
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Guest |
how can the HOLOCAUST be a publicity hoax? To me, that doesn't make any sense at all. It was completely real---You have journals and survivors that give you proof, along with documents and other sources of information. Whoever thought that theory up is completely oblivious...it makes me laugh.
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Mar 19 2005, 06:57 PM
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#22
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 This bitch better work! Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 13,681 Joined: Jul 2004 Member No: 28,095 |
i think that the holocaust was real and i think that the allies helped as soon as they could. i mean, there was a war going on!
 the people should just be happy that the allies helped.
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Mar 20 2005, 01:38 PM
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#23
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WWMD?! - i am from the age of BM 2 Group: Member Posts: 5,308 Joined: Mar 2004 Member No: 8,848 |
QUOTE(iwalkbackwards @ Mar 18 2005, 9:27 AM) Other people believe that it was real, but not as many people died as they say did. I believe that they did exagerate (sp?) a little.. what? no, that many people really did die. maybe not just in concentration camps; people were just being shot on the street for not cooperating. people wouldn't say that many people died if they didn't. |
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Mar 20 2005, 04:27 PM
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#24
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Senior Member Group: Member Posts: 73 Joined: Mar 2005 Member No: 108,896 |
Germany was having trouble
What a sad, sad story Needed a new leader to restore Its former glory Where, oh, where was he? Where could that man be? We looked around and then we found The man for you and me And now it's... Springtime for Hitler and Germany Deutschland is happy and gay! We're marching to a faster pace Look out, here comes the master race! Springtime for Hitler and Germany Rhineland's a fine land once more! Springtime for Hitler and Germany Watch out, Europe We're going on tour! Springtime for Hitler and Germany... Look, it's springtime Winter for Poland and France Springtime for Hitler and Germany! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Springtime! Come on, Germans Go into your dance! I was born in Dusseldorf und that is why they call me Rolf. Don't be stupid, be a smarty, come and join the Nazi party! The Fuhrer is coming, the Fuhrer is coming, the Fuhrer is coming! Heil Hitler! Heil Hitler! Heil Hitler! Springtime for Hitler and Germany Heil Hitler! Heil myself Heil to me I'm the kraut Who's out to change our history Heil myself Raise your hand There's no greater Dictator in the land! Everything I do, I do for you! Yes, you do! If you're looking for a war, here's World War Two! Heil myself Raise your beer Jawohl! Ev'ry hotsy-totsy Nazi stand and cheer Hooray! Ev'ry hotsy-totsy Nazi... Heil myself! Ev'ry hotsy-totsy Nazi... Heil myself! Ev'ry hotsy-totsy Nazi... ...stand and cheer! The Fuhrer is causing a furor! He's got those Russians on the run You gotta love that wacky hun! The Fuhrer is causing a furor They can't say "no" to his demands They're freaking out in foreign lands He's got the whole world in his hands The Fuhrer is causing a furor! I was just a paper hanger No one more obscurer Got a phone call from the Reichstag Told me I was Fuhrer Germany was blue What, oh, what to do? Hitched up my pants And conquered France Now Deutschland's smiling through! But it wasn't always so easy... It was 1932. Hindenburg was working the Big Room and I... I was playing the lounge. And then I got my big break. Somebody burned down the Reichstag. And, would you believe it? They made me Chancellor. Chancellor! It ain't no myst'ry If it's politics or hist'ry The thing you gotta know is Ev'rything is show biz Heil myself Watch my show I'm the German Ethel Merman Dontcha know We are crossing borders The new world order is here Make a great big smile Ev'ryone sieg heil to me Wonderful me! And now it's... Springtime for Hitler and Germany Goose-step's the new step today Springtime! Goose-steps! Bombs falling from the skies again Deutschland is on the rise again Springtime for Hitler and Germany U-boats are sailing once more Springtime for Hitler and Germany Means that... Soon we'll be going... We've got to be going... You know we'll be going.... You bet we'll be going... You know we'll be going to war!! |
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Mar 20 2005, 05:16 PM
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#25
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WWMD?! - i am from the age of BM 2 Group: Member Posts: 5,308 Joined: Mar 2004 Member No: 8,848 |
minda, you're the biggest dork i've ever known.
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