Log In · Register

 

Debate Rules

Here are the general forum rules that you must follow before you start any debate topics. Please make sure you've read and followed all directions.

Debate.

god, part 2
*CEP*
post Jun 11 2004, 11:55 PM
Post #1





Guest






So yeah...the debate continues.. have fun.

- Chinkieeyedpnoi
 
 
Start new topic
Replies
abberdabber
post Jun 13 2004, 04:13 PM
Post #2


crazy*CHRIST*ian
***

Group: Member
Posts: 45
Joined: Jun 2004
Member No: 21,518



.
QUOTE
You mean God will right the wrongs done to Christians. He will still forsake GOOD non-believers because of who they are and who they chose to be.


Mark 10:18
"... 'Why do you call me good?' Jesus answered. 'No one is good- except for God alone'..."

No matter how good you think you are being.. once again, everyone sins. Things that will tempt us into sin will come. God's children are the ones that suffered a life of persecution for their beliefs.. the people that gave their lives up to serve His name.

Luke 9:24
".. 'If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me. For whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me will save it'.."

And no, it doesnt mean die.. as in keel over dead. I'm sure you realize He is speaking of giving up all things in our life that mean anything to us so that we can serve the Lord.

QUOTE
I see, so children, no matter how virtuous or corrupted will still be considered as innocents? While good adults, still 'children' in God's eyes (His children), will suffer the full blown punishments. In that, I see that God discriminates people in different age groups.


No, all sins are equal in the aspect of forgiveness. They arent however considered equally as evil. In the Bible, as they speak of different sins, it is obvious that God is outraged more by some than by others, as in the scripture I gave you yesterday, about the six things the Lord hates, but the seven he finds detestable. He doesnt see all equally.

Leviticus 18
22 " 'Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.

Romans 1


God's Wrath Against Mankind

18The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
21For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.
24Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator--who is forever praised. Amen.
26Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. 27In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.
28Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. 29They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; 31they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.

QUOTE
I still don't understand. He gave us free will to love Him? Can you not hear the hypocrisy in it? If He expects us to love him in the first place, then why give us free will? You have free will to love or not to love Him, but if you choose the latter, you will suffer for eternity. Those are not very good choices to choose from: I would have to force myself to love Him or else I would be condemed.


Once again, No, you will not be condemned for 'not obeying' but for venturing off, and taking your life into your own hands, thinking that you are more capable than our creator.

QUOTE
There are different levels of sins,  however, God will make all sins tantamount to each other. I do not think that's fair. Even in the court system, there are different levels of punishment for different crimes, depending on how severe. We mortals perceive the different levels of punishments, and yet God will see all sins as sins.


How did you come to that conclusion? As I explained above, When it comes to sinning, God sees the sin for what it is. He doesnt however, extend the activities or whatever you want to call it, that we have to do to repent.

QUOTE
The slaughtering of 'heathens' were justified by Christians' belief in God's forgiveness. They killed in His name. I suppose that's due to 'evils', but you see, they were Christians, much like yourself.


First of all, dont generalize. I, in no way, am like any of those people. Just because I am a follower of Christ, and they claimed to be followers of Christ, doesnt mean that we are alike in our beliefs.

QUOTE
It's so easy for people to kill someone and then be forgiven by God. Remember the Crusades? The slaughtering of 'heathens' were justified by Christians' belief in God's forgiveness. They killed in His name. I suppose that's due to 'evils', but you see, they were Christians, much like yourself. Of course, God will forgive you because you believe in Him. I understand.


God can see what's in your heart. He knows the circumstances in which you committed the sin. If you are thinking, as you kill someone, "hmm, this is alright because as soon as I get done with this, I can ask for forgivness.. " He's not going to let it slide like that. And secondly, Just because you've been forgiven, doesnt mean that you dont have to bare the consequences of your actions. If a woman has premarital sex, gets pregnant, then repents.. and God forgives her, it doesnt mean that she still isnt going to carry that consequence with her for the rest of her life. God forgiving you isnt a "get out of jail free pass" its a "Get into Heaven by the blood of Christ pass" there's a difference.

QUOTE
That's true, I was taught to be good. However, being bad can bring satisfaction just as well. I can be good to my family and friends and then cheat strangers, and I will still have the love that I need and gain profits at the same time. But even I know that doing so will destroy my conscience. I don't think of God when I do things to benefit other people, I to have a peaceful life. It's a selfish thing to do, and probably is a sin, but this sin will benefit other people.


Luke 6:46-49

"...'Why do you call me, 'LORD LORD?,' and do not do what I say? I will show you what he is like who comes to me and hars my words and puts them into practice. He is like a man building a house, who dug down deep and laid the foundation on a rock. When a flood came, the torrent sturck that house but could not shake it, because it was well built. But the one who hears my words and does not put them into ppreactice is like a man who built a house on the gournd without a foundation. The moment the torrent struck that house, it collapsed and its destruction was complete.' .."

Without God, no matter how hard you try to live a 'good', (which as I quoted a few minutes ago, is impossible because only God is good) life, you wont be prepared for disaster, and when it does come, things will come crashing down around you.


QUOTE
People need proof today, more than ever. The evils of the world is escalating day by day... we need miracles now and not until it's too late.


Mark 8:12

".. 'Why does this generation ask for a miraculous sign? I tell you the truth, no sign will be given to it.' .."

Matthew 16:2-4

"...'When evening comes, you say, 'It will be fair weather, for the sky is red,' and in the morning, 'Today it will be stormy for the sky is red and overcast.' You know how to interpret the appearance of the sky, but you cannot interpret the signs of the times. A wicked and adulterous generation looks for a miraculous sign, but none will be given it except the sign of Jonah.'.. "


QUOTE
I don't feel as if I'm sitting in a mud puddle, but rather I feel free because I am doing things that will bring me peace of mind.


It just makes me sad because you dont think you're being used by satan, and I dont mean to "destroy God's plans" but .. just in the little things, I'm sure if you evaluate your actions, you would find some similarities in the things that God despises, and the things you find yourself doing from time to time, we all would. Because as you said before, you can get just as much pleasure out of cheating people for self-gain. This is a very corrupt generation and we are tricked into believing that we are doing 'good'. As long as society recognizes us as 'good' people, then we're alright. We are called to do great and wonderous things in the name of God. You'll know you're doing something right when society is against you. Being accepted into this world as 'normal' is the last of my concerns.
 

Posts in this topic
CEP   god   Jun 11 2004, 11:55 PM
abberdabber   this goes out to FAE.. so here ya go. **Is God al...   Jun 11 2004, 11:58 PM
ryfitaDF   QUOTE(abberdabber @ Jun 11 2004, 11:58 PM)thi...   Jun 12 2004, 12:09 AM
iheartsimba   QUOTE(abberdabber @ Jun 11 2004, 11:58 PM)thi...   Jun 12 2004, 12:19 AM
abberdabber   LoL .. Well you guys obviously didnt read back to ...   Jun 12 2004, 12:22 AM
CEP   QUOTE(abberdabber @ Jun 11 2004, 10:22 PM)LoL...   Jun 12 2004, 01:30 AM
abberdabber   * this will be the last entry submitted * fae wa...   Jun 12 2004, 01:52 AM
synkro   just wondering.. have any of you ever read the boo...   Jun 12 2004, 08:05 AM
princess2113   QUOTE(synkro @ Jun 12 2004, 8:05 AM)just wond...   Jun 12 2004, 09:00 AM
synkro   QUOTE(princess2113 @ Jun 12 2004, 9:00 AM)not...   Jun 12 2004, 09:17 AM
princess2113   QUOTE(synkro @ Jun 12 2004, 9:17 AM)what...   Jun 12 2004, 10:28 AM
CEP   QUOTE(synkro @ Jun 12 2004, 6:05 AM)just wond...   Jun 12 2004, 10:40 AM
IIO__oII   u guys should read MERE CHRISTIANITY.. =] PS...ch...   Jun 12 2004, 11:53 AM
GinaDaQueen   I haven't really read the other topic but from...   Jun 12 2004, 02:21 PM
easilyxamusedx   nicely said.   Jun 12 2004, 02:29 PM
DisneyPrincessKate   I honestly don't see how you can't believe...   Jun 12 2004, 02:31 PM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(GinaDaQueen @ Jun 12 2004, 2:21 PM)I ha...   Jun 12 2004, 03:17 PM
synkro   it wasn't a question whether the book was true...   Jun 12 2004, 06:27 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(abberdabber @ Jun 11 2004, 11:58 PM)gos...   Jun 12 2004, 07:16 PM
machinoman   I just saw Saved! and it was great. "Jes...   Jun 13 2004, 02:56 AM
abberdabber   [QUOTE=uninspiredfae,Jun 12 2004, 7:16 PM] Just ...   Jun 13 2004, 03:47 AM
Spirited Away   So things that you speak from the heart comes fro...   Jun 13 2004, 10:15 AM
princess2113   alrite u want us to give u OUR knowledge, but we ...   Jun 13 2004, 10:35 AM
sadolakced acid   i have a question for all you christians out there...   Jun 13 2004, 02:14 PM
abberdabber   alright i jacked it up again, i answered at two di...   Jun 13 2004, 03:13 PM
abberdabber   .QUOTEYou mean God will right the wrongs done to C...   Jun 13 2004, 04:13 PM
IIO__oII   YAY fresh and new! no more scrolling thru 50+ ...   Jun 13 2004, 04:39 PM
abberdabber   yea i know, its a whole lot better than before...   Jun 13 2004, 05:23 PM
princess2113   wait to answer that other persons ??....Creation d...   Jun 13 2004, 08:40 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(princess2113 @ Jun 13 2004, 10:35 AM)al...   Jun 13 2004, 09:05 PM
Spirited Away   First of all, sorry for double posting. That...   Jun 13 2004, 09:47 PM
princess2113   second-hand knowledge???? u trust ur history book...   Jun 13 2004, 10:01 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(princess2113 @ Jun 13 2004, 10:01 PM)u ...   Jun 13 2004, 10:06 PM
abberdabber   Fae, are you sure thats the reason you continue to...   Jun 13 2004, 10:06 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(abberdabber @ Jun 13 2004, 10:06 PM)Fae...   Jun 13 2004, 10:14 PM
DisneyPrincessKate   You guys are so nit-picky and technical. The impo...   Jun 13 2004, 10:42 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(DisneyPrincessKate @ Jun 13 2004, 10:42...   Jun 13 2004, 10:49 PM
princess2113   QUOTE(uninspiredfae @ Jun 13 2004, 10:06 PM)W...   Jun 13 2004, 10:59 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(princess2113 @ Jun 13 2004, 10:59 PM)...   Jun 13 2004, 11:05 PM
abberdabber   QUOTEHow have you suffered persecution for your be...   Jun 13 2004, 11:06 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(abberdabber @ Jun 13 2004, 11:06 PM)Fae...   Jun 13 2004, 11:19 PM
sadolakced acid   sure, christians shouldn't be persecuted for w...   Jun 13 2004, 11:46 PM
ryfitaDF   QUOTE(sadolakced acid @ Jun 13 2004, 11:46 PM...   Jun 14 2004, 12:02 AM
abberdabber   Fae, ive been reading through the last few posts o...   Jun 14 2004, 02:25 AM
synkro   i find it interesting that when we say "god...   Jun 14 2004, 04:54 AM
DisneyPrincessKate   QUOTE(uninspiredfae @ Jun 13 2004, 11:49 PM)W...   Jun 14 2004, 09:43 AM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(abberdabber @ Jun 14 2004, 2:25 AM)Fae,...   Jun 14 2004, 10:25 AM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(synkro @ Jun 14 2004, 4:54 AM)i find it...   Jun 14 2004, 10:34 AM
synkro   QUOTEBut since everyone has been saying that God w...   Jun 14 2004, 10:42 AM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(synkro @ Jun 14 2004, 10:42 AM)you may ...   Jun 14 2004, 10:54 AM
synkro   QUOTE(uninspiredfae @ Jun 14 2004, 10:54 AM)I...   Jun 14 2004, 10:58 AM
IIO__oII   QUOTEWhy believe in something I cannot see, when I...   Jun 14 2004, 04:37 PM
ryfitaDF   i'm cool with anyone, believer or not.   Jun 14 2004, 05:54 PM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(uninspiredfae @ Jun 13 2004, 11:05 PM)G...   Jun 14 2004, 07:20 PM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(uninspiredfae @ Jun 14 2004, 10:25 AM)H...   Jun 14 2004, 07:34 PM
IIO__oII   QUOTEI know many don't like quotings of the Bi...   Jun 14 2004, 08:59 PM
ryfitaDF   what about all the revisions of the bible? you may...   Jun 14 2004, 09:18 PM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(ryfitaDF @ Jun 14 2004, 9:18 PM)what ab...   Jun 15 2004, 06:40 AM
Retrogressive   i used to be a very strong christian, i even had a...   Jun 16 2004, 04:40 PM
Yemmerz   QUOTE(ryfitaDF @ Jun 14 2004, 10:18 PM)what a...   Jun 16 2004, 04:46 PM
JlIaTMK   im christian and i personally dont believe so much...   Jun 16 2004, 08:55 PM
shawty_redd   QUOTE(Yemmerz @ Jun 16 2004, 3:46 PM)It does,...   Jun 16 2004, 10:47 PM
ryfitaDF   QUOTE(shawty_redd @ Jun 16 2004, 10:47 PM)so ...   Jun 17 2004, 02:01 AM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(ryfitaDF @ Jun 17 2004, 2:01 AM)yes. i ...   Jun 17 2004, 09:14 AM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(CrimsonArchangel @ Jun 17 2004, 9:14 AM...   Jun 17 2004, 09:39 AM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(uninspiredfae @ Jun 17 2004, 9:39 AM)I ...   Jun 17 2004, 10:46 AM
Spirited Away   Here you go (<--about midrash).   Jun 17 2004, 10:51 AM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(uninspiredfae @ Jun 17 2004, 10:51 AM)H...   Jun 17 2004, 10:56 AM
ryfitaDF   QUOTE(loseronaisle5 @ Jun 16 2004, 4:40 PM)bu...   Jun 17 2004, 02:12 PM
IIO__oII   QUOTEf i believed in god i wouldn't think he h...   Jun 17 2004, 03:38 PM
onenonly101   QUOTEi don't want to believe in a god who does...   Jun 18 2004, 03:59 PM
Gypsy Eyes   Personally, I dont believe in god. I honestly thin...   Jun 18 2004, 05:56 PM
ryfitaDF   QUOTE(Gypsy Eyes @ Jun 18 2004, 5:56 PM)Perso...   Jun 19 2004, 12:31 AM
kryogenix   QUOTE(Gypsy Eyes @ Jun 18 2004, 5:56 PM)Perso...   Jun 19 2004, 07:43 AM
ryfitaDF   QUOTE-Evolution is as much as a theory as the stor...   Jun 19 2004, 11:05 AM
onenonly101   QUOTE(Gypsy Eyes @ Jun 18 2004, 5:56 PM)Perso...   Jun 19 2004, 11:49 AM
ryfitaDF   QUOTE(onenonly101 @ Jun 19 2004, 11:49 AM)The...   Jun 19 2004, 12:56 PM
onenonly101   but didn't you say you believe in your self? t...   Jun 19 2004, 04:04 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(onenonly101 @ Jun 19 2004, 11:49 AM)Fir...   Jun 19 2004, 04:20 PM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(ryfitaDF @ Jun 19 2004, 12:56 PM)then w...   Jun 19 2004, 09:30 PM
Lena   QUOTE(onenonly101 @ Jun 19 2004, 4:04 PM)but ...   Jun 19 2004, 10:06 PM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(Lena @ Jun 19 2004, 10:06 PM)CrimsonArc...   Jun 19 2004, 11:01 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTEThen I ask you...who created the so called cr...   Jun 20 2004, 01:36 AM
Gypsy Eyes   QUOTE(CrimsonArchangel @ Jun 19 2004, 9:30 PM...   Jun 20 2004, 01:49 PM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(Gypsy Eyes @ Jun 20 2004, 1:49 PM)Lamb ...   Jun 20 2004, 03:28 PM
ryfitaDF   QUOTE(CrimsonArchangel @ Jun 20 2004, 3:28 PM...   Jun 20 2004, 03:53 PM
CrimsonArchangel   QUOTE(ryfitaDF @ Jun 20 2004, 3:53 PM)why not...   Jun 20 2004, 04:00 PM
onenonly101   QUOTEI've never heard of the Ten Commandments ...   Jun 21 2004, 11:47 AM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(onenonly101 @ Jun 21 2004, 11:47 AM)You...   Jun 21 2004, 12:06 PM
onenonly101   QUOTESo you're saying that before the Ten Comm...   Jun 21 2004, 12:35 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(onenonly101 @ Jun 21 2004, 12:35 PM)I d...   Jun 21 2004, 12:44 PM
IIO__oII   QUOTEIf trusting God makes my life easier were tru...   Jun 21 2004, 03:55 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(IIO__oII @ Jun 21 2004, 3:55 PM)maybe i...   Jun 21 2004, 04:35 PM
IIO__oII   QUOTEi don't get you. first you say that Chri...   Jun 21 2004, 05:42 PM
Spirited Away   QUOTE(IIO__oII @ Jun 21 2004, 5:42 PM)err.. w...   Jun 21 2004, 05:47 PM
ComradeRed   How will you spend eternity? Smoking or non-smokin...   Jun 21 2004, 08:15 PM
ryfitaDF   raise your fist in the air. DRUG FREE!   Jun 22 2004, 01:01 AM
stryker76   Yeah i have to agree the christains do suffer more...   Jun 22 2004, 06:10 AM
onenonly101   i don't know if this is what princess and iio_...   Jun 22 2004, 10:13 AM
Beyond Elite   oh my. People are crazy about this topic huh?   Jun 22 2004, 10:44 AM
7 Pages V   1 2 3 > » 


Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members: