Evangelism |
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Evangelism |
May 30 2006, 07:59 PM
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Lauren loves YOU. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Member Posts: 2,357 Joined: Jul 2004 Member No: 32,793 |
A good friend of mine and I recently got into a heated debate about evangelism. We're both Christians, but we have very different ideas about evangelism. When my friend started getting really involved in church a few years ago, he also became a rampant evangelist. He believes that by bringing more people into the church he is not only saving them from eternal damnation, but also doing his duty as a Christian. He has often quoted Charles Spurgeon, saying "Every Christian is either a missionary or an imposter," essentially stating that you can't truly be Christian without evangelizing non believers.
I, however, don't like the idea of evangelism at all. Although I'm a devout Catholic, I dislike the idea of evangelism because I don't believe that anybody, myself included, has the right to force his or her beliefs on someone else. I think that everybody has a right to be whatever the religion they choose. Perhaps it's because I have a different idea about God than other people. I don't think that God sends honestly good people to Hell just because they don't believe in him. There are such things as Christian people who are hypocritical, paying lip service to God at church on Sundays, and still go about causing harm to other people. In my opinion, these people are less deserving of heaven than the good-hearted people whose only "fault" is that they don't believe in God. I think that my duty as a Christian is to be a good person and have a positive impact on the world, which doesn't necessarily mean that I HAVE to be an evangelist. I'd just like to know what everyone else's opinion is on this, not merely from a Christian standpoint, but from another religion's or atheist's perspective as well. Do you approve of evangelism? Are you an evangelist? Do you think that evangelism is a necessary requirement for all good Christians? |
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Dec 6 2006, 07:15 AM
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#2
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Member Posts: 60 Joined: Nov 2006 Member No: 481,822 |
Acid Bath Slayer
How many grains of sand make up all the islands of Hawaii ? What is the average number of hairs on a full-grown Tibetan yak ? Clearly, you cannot answer these questions because you do not have absolute knowledge. Did you know that Thomas Edison said, "We do not know one-milliionth of one percent about anything" ? You can agree or disagree with this, but clearly you know nowhere near all there is to know. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt and say that you know a whopping 1% of ALL there is know. Wouldn't you agree that in the 99% of what you don't know and haven't come across yet, that this could be where evidence resides that proves God's existence ? Wouldn't you agree that the 1% of absolute knowledge you hold onto so tightly has kept from seeing the other 99% ? I hope you'd agree that you have nowhere near absolute knowledge. Therefore, you're left with less-than-absolute knowledge. So, instead of saying your an atheist (there is no God), you must be an agnostic (just not sure). More quotes: Sir Isaac Newton said, "This most beautiful system of the sun, planets, and comets, could only proceed from the counsel and dominion of an intelligent and powerful Being." Scientist Stephen Hawking is his book, A Brief History of Time said, "It would be very difficult to explain why the universe should have begun in just this way, except as the act of a God who intended to create beings like us." Albert Einstein didn't believe in the God of the Bible, but he wasn't a fool. He knew that there was a Creator. He said, "God does not play dice [with the universe]." "Everyone who is seriously involved in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the Universe--a spirit vastly superior to that of man, and one in the face of which our modest powers must feel humble." (The Quotable Einstein, p. 152). Professor Louis Bounoure, Director of Research, National Center of Scientific Research so rightly stated: "Evolution is a fairy tale for grown-ups. This theory has helped nothing in the progress of science. It is useless." Sir Arthur Keith (Sir Arthur Keith wrote the foreword to the 100th edition of Origin of the Species) said, "Evolution is unproved and unprovable." Malcolm Muggeridge, the famous British journalist and philosopher said, "I myself am convinced that the theory of evolution, especially the extent to which it’s been applied, will be one of the great jokes in history books of the future." (The End of Christendom, Eerdmans, Grand Rapids, Mich., 1980, page 59). Dr. T. N. Tah-misian of the Atomic Energy Commission said, "Scientists who go about teaching that evolution is a fact of life are great con-men, and the story they are telling may be the greatest hoax ever." "Paleontologists have discovered a new skeleton in the closet of human ancestry that is likely to force science to revise, if not scrap, current theories of human origins." USA Today March 21, 2001 Reuters reported that the discovery left "scientists of human evolution…confused," saying, "Lucy may not even be a direct human ancestor after all." Bottom line is that I fear for you. You might not care about that, but I see you jumping out of an airplane with no parachute cursing God and the law of gravity for taking you down. Please don't continue along the path of self-righteousness (seeing yourself as right and not seeing yourself the way God sees you) and rejection of the God that gave you life. I certainly don't expect you to respond saying, "Yes !! I see now !! You're right !!" But, consider that every day that He gives you breath is a chance for you to call out to Him and ask Him to forgive you for your anger toward Him and to repent and give your life to Him. You can't guarantee that you'll wake up tomorrow. Please don't put your head on your pillow tonight without getting right with God. Spirited Away QUOTE This is relevant to the original discussion, how one Christian thinks Christianity should be practiced: "Everybody thinks of changing humanity and nobody thinks of changing himself." --Leo Tolstoy Interesting quote. I'm not sure if you're just asking for my opinion on it, though. Do you believe that this quote indicates something significant to someone who calls himself / herself a Christian ? To me, it immediately implies humanism. Since I hold to a Biblical worldview, I see little truth to Tolstoy's statement. The little bit of truth I do see is that everyone does want to change others before changes occur within themselves. Jesus Himself said this in that people will always look to the speck in someone else's eye before looking to the log in their own. As for "changing himself", I don't believe anyone can change themselves. Deep down to the core, people will lean toward doing that which is unacceptable to the Lord. You don't have to teach a little child to lie. They do it simply because it seems right. Only God can truly change someone. I know men who've had $300 a day cocaine habits that stopped and turned on a dime because they repented and put their trust in Jesus Christ. I know others that have similar victories over alcohol, smoking, pornography, etc. They will immediately tell anyone that they'd tried to change themselves before, but it never "stuck". So, I don't believe anyone can change themselves for a lasting change. It's a temporary patch, if that. Only the God who calls Himself "The Beginning and the End" can do an everlasting work in someone since He always was, is, and always will be. For anyone else reading Please don't get lost in the details here. The important thing is your eternal destiny. Do you think you're going to Heaven when you die ? Are you 100% sure you'll make it ? What does it take to get there ? Do you think it's based on being a "good person" ? Are you a "good person" ? If you've lied, stolen, used the Lord's Name in vain, looked at someone with lustful thoughts, then you're a lying, thieving, blasphemous, adulterer at heart. This is how God sees you and you will be found guilty of breaking just those 4 of His Ten Commandments. Please consider your eternal destiny. Where would a guilty sentence send you ? That answer should fill you with fear, but knowing that God didn't want that for you and knowing what He did so that wouldn't happen to you should fill you with tears. He sent His Son to die on a cross to pay your fine and He raised Him from the grave and defeated death so that you could escape the wrath to come. Please don't let your pride in thinking that you can merit your way into Heaven keep you from humbling yourself and looking to Him for something you can't do yourself. Please. |
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yummy_delight Evangelism May 30 2006, 07:59 PM
kryogenix QUOTEdon't think that God sends honestly good ... May 31 2006, 02:37 PM
sadolakced acid i would think, in all logic, they would be more un... Jun 1 2006, 11:03 PM
ermfermoo They bother me. A lot.
Why, you ask? Because they... Jun 5 2006, 04:16 PM
×__Fcuk. Umm..no offence to anyone here, but I think Evange... Jun 7 2006, 12:59 PM
ermfermoo QUOTE(×__Fcuk. @ Jun 7 2006, 1:59 PM) My ... Jun 7 2006, 10:07 PM
×__Fcuk. QUOTE(ermfermoo @ Jun 7 2006, 10:07 PM) I... Jun 7 2006, 11:56 PM
L!ckitySplit dont listen to franki ariel, she's INSANE.
yo... Jun 7 2006, 10:14 PM
marzipan QUOTE(yummy_delight @ May 30 2006, 7:59 P... Jun 7 2006, 10:14 PM
n00b well I don't think you should be forced into a... Jun 7 2006, 10:18 PM
StanleyThePanda Forcing your religion on them isnt cool, no.
But I... Jun 7 2006, 10:23 PM
fifthing I fully agree with your stance on the matter. I pr... Jun 7 2006, 11:56 PM
Shulace I recently took a class on apologetics, learning h... Jun 8 2006, 12:15 AM
×__Fcuk. ^ Bravo. =) Jun 8 2006, 12:16 AM
sadolakced acid only one person can make me do that, and he is god... Jun 8 2006, 04:29 AM
happykmd Ahh I really dont like Evangelists. But ironically... Jul 29 2006, 12:14 AM
rorhinna I would like to just define something. I have been... Aug 10 2006, 12:34 AM
zebzie Its called faith WITH works. If you believe in God... Aug 10 2006, 01:38 AM
ktsou11 As Christians, we're called upon by God's ... Aug 11 2006, 07:33 PM
JakeKKing QUOTE(yummy_delight @ May 30 2006, 7:59 P... Aug 13 2006, 05:27 PM
SilverNoOne Evangelism is being just as open about talking abo... Aug 16 2006, 10:04 PM
chasingvictory well to me Evangelism isn't, "forcing his... Aug 17 2006, 01:00 PM
thanhmai I believe that people should have the free will to... Aug 18 2006, 11:19 AM
sadolakced acid hello my name is justin and i'd like to ... Aug 19 2006, 05:51 PM
thanhmai QUOTE(sadolakced acid @ Aug 19 2006, 3:51... Aug 20 2006, 01:21 AM
Angelina Taylor QUOTE(sadolakced acid @ Aug 19 2006, 6:51... Aug 20 2006, 04:05 PM
SilverNoOne QUOTE(Angelina Taylor @ Aug 20 2006, 4:05... Aug 20 2006, 08:09 PM
Brittany Rachelle once these people came to my friends door and scar... Aug 20 2006, 01:32 AM
ScottD Is there anyone listed here that would have to sto... Nov 22 2006, 08:19 AM
happykmd ^ Nice post. But quoting scriptures doesnt mean so... Nov 27 2006, 05:24 PM
sadolakced acid The worst kind of people are those who are falsely... Nov 28 2006, 01:06 AM
ScottD QUOTENice post. But quoting scriptures doesnt mean... Nov 28 2006, 02:16 PM
happykmd QUOTEI'm glad you're honest enough to reco... Dec 4 2006, 08:06 PM
icy_wonderland QUOTE(ScottD @ Nov 29 2006, 3:16 AM) I na... Dec 5 2006, 07:45 AM
sadolakced acid now i have a question for you. how do you know, t... Nov 29 2006, 02:25 AM
splitnightsky don't judge me for judging you.
cuz then we g... Nov 29 2006, 07:44 AM
ScottD QUOTEnow i have a question for you. how do you kno... Nov 29 2006, 10:23 AM
splitnightsky to answer you without quoting (geez that was long)... Nov 29 2006, 02:27 PM
ScottD Yeah, sorry. I get verbose. I hope you do get th... Nov 29 2006, 03:33 PM
splitnightsky I really don't feel like discussing this anymo... Nov 29 2006, 05:16 PM
ScottD For anyone else reading this thead, please don... Dec 1 2006, 03:39 PM
sadolakced acid I'm sorry, but i don't trust the bible. I... Dec 2 2006, 02:36 AM
Spirited Away Have you turn to deism, Justin? Dec 2 2006, 10:28 AM
sadolakced acid no, but i'm arguing one's point of view fo... Dec 3 2006, 01:52 PM
insomniac scottd, are you by chance a messianic jew? your ic... Dec 3 2006, 10:57 PM
ScottD sadolakced acid:
If you want to follow God, but do... Dec 4 2006, 08:57 AM
insomniac QUOTEWhen you say that you sat through all the lec... Dec 4 2006, 06:30 PM
happykmd ^ Yeah. How can you believe in Christ, and not be ... Dec 4 2006, 07:49 PM
ScottD QUOTEBut the faith itself, there is one God, and h... Dec 5 2006, 07:30 AM
happykmd QUOTEI very much appreciate you both bringing out ... Dec 5 2006, 07:49 PM
ScottD Good morning, icy_wonderland.
If you believe it... Dec 5 2006, 08:00 AM
icy_wonderland I don't have to be Christian to care about oth... Dec 5 2006, 08:05 AM
ScottD Your point is very well made. In no way would I e... Dec 5 2006, 08:53 AM
Acid Bath Slayer QUOTE(ScottD @ Dec 5 2006, 7:00 AM) Since... Dec 5 2006, 06:22 PM
happykmd QUOTE(Acid Bath Slayer @ Dec 5 2006, 6:22... Dec 5 2006, 07:18 PM
ScottD I can only assume that since you mention "the... Dec 5 2006, 07:30 PM
Acid Bath Slayer [quote name='ScottD' date='Dec 5 2006,... Dec 5 2006, 08:44 PM
Angelina Taylor QUOTE(ScottD @ Dec 5 2006, 7:30 PM) As fo... Dec 23 2006, 11:39 AM
ScottD QUOTEOk, but if you knew in advance that someone w... Dec 5 2006, 08:47 PM
Spirited Away This is relevant to the original discussion, how o... Dec 5 2006, 11:19 PM
Acid Bath Slayer QUOTE(ScottD @ Dec 6 2006, 6:15 AM) Acid ... Dec 6 2006, 06:21 PM
happykmd QUOTE(ScottD @ Dec 6 2006, 7:15 AM) Acid ... Dec 6 2006, 07:50 PM
Spirited Away QUOTE(ScottD @ Dec 6 2006, 6:15 AM) Spiri... Dec 6 2006, 08:40 PM
happykmd QUOTEIf God sees me as badly as you have said (bla... Dec 6 2006, 08:48 PM
ScottD Acid Bath Slayer, you had mentioned earlier that t... Dec 7 2006, 08:25 AM
Spirited Away QUOTE(ScottD @ Dec 7 2006, 7:25 AM) But, ... Dec 7 2006, 04:53 PM
Acid Bath Slayer QUOTE(ScottD @ Dec 7 2006, 7:25 AM) Acid ... Dec 12 2006, 12:22 AM
ScottD QUOTENote that reasons do not excuse, they simply ... Dec 8 2006, 08:40 AM
insomniac ahh, i missed a page. i'll try to catch up as ... Dec 8 2006, 07:45 PM
ScottD Good morning, insomniac.
In no way did I mean to ... Dec 9 2006, 08:36 AM
Spirited Away Yes! Haha, they will get burned and they will ... Dec 9 2006, 05:12 PM
ScottD QUOTEIf you can hold off responding to me until th... Dec 11 2006, 06:55 PM
happykmd QUOTEIf you can hold off responding to me until th... Dec 11 2006, 07:01 PM
Spirited Away I edited my post to keep it all in one place for e... Dec 19 2006, 01:05 AM
happykmd ^ Eeeeep. All but two kids out of 23 failed the En... Dec 20 2006, 09:54 AM
happykmd ^ I agree. People try to throw bible verses and ot... Dec 26 2006, 12:32 AM
ScottD Spirited Away,
I hope I haven't broken any r... Dec 28 2006, 10:10 AM
ScottD Angelina Taylor,
As strongly as you clearly do no... Dec 28 2006, 12:39 PM
Angelina Taylor QUOTE(ScottD @ Dec 28 2006, 12:39 PM) Ang... Dec 28 2006, 07:46 PM
ScottD QUOTESeriously? You're actually serious?
With... Dec 29 2006, 03:47 PM
ursedonah QUOTE(ScottD @ Dec 29 2006, 3:47 PM) If w... Dec 29 2006, 05:02 PM
Angelina Taylor [quote name='ScottD' date='Dec 29 2006... Dec 29 2006, 05:16 PM
Obscure Enigma I think evangelism is fine, in a sence that you in... Dec 30 2006, 09:55 AM
ScottD I apologize for my long response here. ursedonah ... Jan 3 2007, 10:10 AM
Angelina Taylor QUOTE(ScottD @ Jan 3 2007, 10:10 AM) Isai... Jan 3 2007, 01:50 PM
ursedonah QUOTE(ScottD @ Jan 3 2007, 10:10 AM) I ap... Jan 3 2007, 05:37 PM
ScottD Quick question on replying: Are there a limited n... Jan 10 2007, 01:16 PM
Angelina Taylor I will just say one thing and I'll rest my cas... Jan 10 2007, 02:56 PM
I Shot JFK QUOTEConsider a little boy who is looking at a hea... Jan 10 2007, 06:34 PM
sadolakced acid ScottD, i don't have time to read through all ... Jan 10 2007, 08:26 PM
ScottD QUOTEFrom Angelina Taylor:
I will just say one thi... Jan 11 2007, 07:06 AM
Angelina Taylor Intelligent Design vs. Evolution? HAHAHAHA, okay. ... Jan 11 2007, 07:27 AM
sadolakced acid Well, do you agree that an athiest such as myself ... Jan 12 2007, 11:21 PM
ScottD QUOTEFrom Angelina Taylor:
Please, don't pray ... Jan 17 2007, 07:18 AM
sadolakced acid well, i'll tell you what i believe.
i believe... Jan 18 2007, 02:12 AM
silly ol' man ^ Respect? Yeah, you're a model of respect -- ... Jan 18 2007, 02:21 AM
sadolakced acid of course, and if you'd paid a shit of attenti... Jan 18 2007, 02:39 AM
silly ol' man QUOTE(sadolakced acid @ Jan 18 2007, 1:39... Jan 18 2007, 06:51 PM
Heath21 QUOTE(yummy_delight @ May 30 2006, 4:59 P... Jan 18 2007, 04:53 PM![]() ![]() |