god thread, number 3 Options

[*disco infiltrator*]

So, it seems that everything talked about in another thread leads to religion.

So here we are!
Debate the existence of God and which one's right and stuff.

I would post links to God threads 1 & 2, but you can't search for three-letter words.
(2 got to 50 pages, think we can beat it?!?)

Er, I'll start.
I'm atheist. Prove me wrong.
By prove, I mean state facts that have been backed up by solid evidence. I have yet to see that happen in all 70 combined pages of threads 1 & 2.

[richc]

1. What is faith, exactly?

uh...belief in Jesus Christ, that he was the one and only God. and that He died for our sins.

2. How can we know that we are operating under fatih?

many people who say they are christians have christianity as just part of their life. you are operating under faith when your entire life REVOLVES around your faith. not just one part of it.

3. How do we gain accurate knowledge from mechanisms of faith?

read the bible....

4. What exactly are the mechanisms of faith?

Well. Following God and his rules to the best of your ability. Admitting that you are a sinner. Believing that Jesus died for our sins, then rose again. committing your life to serving God with the talents He gave you.

5. Of what value is faith?
6. Of what use is faith?

kinda the same question.

something i think people dont understand (atheists...)...when they ask the question, "why doesnt God just come save us?"

well, as a christian, life is hard. its inevitable. life is hard. and you might not be satisfied with your life AND THAT IS RIGHT. cause you were made for more than that. you think Earth is your final destination? nononno, earth is just "an inch on a tape measure from New York and San Francesco." Only at HEAVEN will we be satisfied. the Switchfoot CD, "Nothing is SOund" nothing satisfies here on earth.

so why doesnt God save us? save us from what? save us from Death? haha, death is the one way to SATISFACTION. even the most "christiany" people you know are totally satisfied.

and why doesnt God give us all salvation?
well, some believe in predestination. others say that ....idunno cause i beleive in predestination.

[NoSex]

1. What is faith, exactly?

uh...belief in Jesus Christ, that he was the one and only God. and that He died for our sins.

Alright. You are defining faith as a belief system.

2. How can we know that we are operating under fatih?

many people who say they are christians have christianity as just part of their life. you are operating under faith when your entire life REVOLVES around your faith. not just one part of it.

So, when you base a choice on reason, you would be operating on faith? This seems contradictory.

3. How do we gain accurate knowledge from mechanisms of faith?

read the bible....

Alright. How does reading the bible provide as we knowledge that we can classify as accurate?

Reading something usually involves basic cognitive faculties. We comprehend what is on paper and in decided on whether or not to believe said text, we use, in most cases, reason. My questions are pertaining to people who believe that we use "faith" to come to a conclusion on any given truth value.

How does the act of simply reading the Bible present us with accurate knowledge?
How is that any different then reading any other form of text?
How can I use "faith" to gain accurate knowledge from the Bible?

4. What exactly are the mechanisms of faith?

Well. Following God and his rules to the best of your ability. Admitting that you are a sinner. Believing that Jesus died for our sins, then rose again. committing your life to serving God with the talents He gave you.

By mechanism of faith, I meant to ask exactly how by using faith do we come to gain knowledge?

Reason is a well defined and developed way of knowing. I'm asking you, for the most part, to explain what allows us to gain knowledge under the use of faith.

5. Of what value is faith?
6. Of what use is faith?

kinda the same question.

something i think people dont understand (atheists...)...when they ask the question, "why doesnt God just come save us?"

well, as a christian, life is hard. its inevitable. life is hard. and you might not be satisfied with your life AND THAT IS RIGHT. cause you were made for more than that. you think Earth is your final destination? nononno, earth is just "an inch on a tape measure from New York and San Francesco." Only at HEAVEN will we be satisfied. the Switchfoot CD, "Nothing is SOund" nothing satisfies here on earth.

so why doesnt God save us? save us from what? save us from Death? haha, death is the one way to SATISFACTION. even the most "christiany" people you know are totally satisfied.

and why doesnt God give us all salvation?
well, some believe in predestination. others say that ....idunno cause i beleive in predestination.

How do you know any of these things?
If you can know them, please explain them.
Why is any of this true?

You have, for the most part, gone off an a tangent that is non sequitur, and for the most part meaningless. You had missed my most important questions, and failed to accurate answer the rest.

All I want to know, is how can we gain knowledge from faith? So far, your argument seems circular and noncoherent. If faith is simply the belief in "Jesus Christ," how does holding any specific belief let us know anything?

Try at #7, please.

7. Imagine that we were to put several individuals in a room to observe an event and attempt to explain said event with two different tools. In the first test we would give them the tools of logic science as a means to explain the observed event. Several of the individuals came out with different explanations. As logic is a tightly defined process, we can study each participant's methodology to determine who went wrong and where, and who has created a cogent, cohesive, and deductive explanation. We can explain why different people came about different explanations and show them what needs to be done in order to become more accurate in their observations, and explanations. Now, moving into the second test, we would give that participants the supposed tools of faith as a means to explain the observed events. Coming out of the experiment, each participant has came to a different conclusion and explanation. How do we determine who is right and who is wrong in their explanations?

Also, here are some additional questions.

8. Imagine that you were given three divine messages. One of these messages was true. Using faith, how do you determine which message is true?

9. Can you base a choice on faith?

10. If so, how would you go about making such a choice?

Also, on a far more important note. I think we need to focus alot less time on the question "Does God Exist," and more time on the question, "Should we believe a God exists?"

I was never proposing that we could deductively prove or disprove the existence of ever possible god figure. My arguments are based in rationalism and do not even assume such a possibility. The matter I care to deal with are the realities behind reason and faith, epistemology, and what we should believe and why. Not exactly a deductive conclusion on the matter.