PETITION FOR TECHNOLOGY SECTION MODERATOR |
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PETITION FOR TECHNOLOGY SECTION MODERATOR |
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#1
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
Seeing that technology isn't so much a general knowledge or opinion topic as is something like art or books, I say we should have a specific moderator (maybe two, any more would be a bit excessive) for the technology forum.
If this idea passes, give it to someone who knows what they're talking about, doesn't want to kill the homosexuals (aka Tama), and actually logs in every once in a while. All in favor, VOTE YES. |
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#2
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![]() I'm Jc ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Mentor Posts: 13,619 Joined: Jul 2006 Member No: 437,556 ![]() |
what are they going to do that's any different than a normal moderator? if they are just going to close topics or move topics, ect, then what does more technology knowledge have to do with it
not sure what you mean |
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#3
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Designer Posts: 5,880 Joined: Nov 2007 Member No: 593,382 ![]() |
Couldn't agree more.
There are so many technology threads. In technology, there should be, software, hardware, and gaming. |
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#4
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
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#5
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![]() I'm Jc ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Mentor Posts: 13,619 Joined: Jul 2006 Member No: 437,556 ![]() |
that's not giving any examples though on how being more knowledgeable about technology has anything to do with the tasks moderators perform. i mean i know what your saying, i just don't get how it really makes a difference. you don't need to know that much to close a topic or move it when it has nothing to do with technology.
i duno. i just don't see the need, just like i don't see the need for specific moderators of any other specific sub-forum. cause i don't see what they would do that's different |
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#6
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![]() ٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 14,309 Joined: Nov 2004 Member No: 65,593 ![]() |
lol if yall wanted to get so specific with technology, go to a real technology forum.
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#7
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![]() Mel Blanc was allergic to carrots. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Designer Posts: 6,371 Joined: Aug 2008 Member No: 676,291 ![]() |
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#8
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
Because there are no opinions in technology. In art, "this should go there instead" is subjective. When you're building a computer, "This should go there instead of where you put it" means horrible system failure.
They wouldn't do anything different, I just consider it a good thing to have people moderate things they know something about. Also, this is the only forum I visit that has a technology subforum without a specific moderator for it. And this is also the smallest forum I visit. 1+1+2=4 |
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#9
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![]() Amberific. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 12,913 Joined: Jul 2004 Member No: 29,772 ![]() |
Is technology that active? And we've talked about moderator specific forums in the past, but it's always agreed upon that that's unnecessary. In theory, all mods with powers in that forum should be checking up on it (although I'm guilty of not doing so). But Michael's pretty active in there, right?
Edit: And breaking down technology into subforums verges on fastidiousness. Just sayin'. |
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#10
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![]() I'm Jc ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Mentor Posts: 13,619 Joined: Jul 2006 Member No: 437,556 ![]() |
well moderators aren't building computers, they're moderating a forum and moving a topic isn't gonna cause system failure. whether there are opinions really has nothing to do with moderator actions either i don't think, shrug.
i don't really care either way, but if we put a specific mod for technology then we'd have to deal with specific moderators for other forums that don't need it too. |
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#11
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
Is technology that active? And we've talked about moderator specific forums in the past, but it's always agreed upon that that's unnecessary. In theory, all mods with powers in that forum should be checking up on it (although I'm guilty of not doing so). But Michael's pretty active in there, right? Edit: And breaking down technology into subforums verges on fastidiousness. Just sayin'. Bold text. Hardware, software, and gaming are completely different sections of gaming. I know people who know nothing about hardware or software, but game like a god. I know people that know nothing about hardware, and can't play anything worth shit, but jesus their way around the operating system. And I know people that don't know shit about software or gaming, but can build a working computer from a handful of wires and a diode. And then I know people good with two of them, all three, or none at all. |
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#12
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![]() I'm Jc ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Mentor Posts: 13,619 Joined: Jul 2006 Member No: 437,556 ![]() |
then i guess people can go in the topics they know shit about and stay out of the ones they don't. i mean i don't get it, you're not saying anything relevant to a moderator or what a moderator does.
that would be completely silly for us to break technology into categories like that. then we could break music into categories, and videos, and art, and every other sub forum. it's not like there is OMG SO MANY TECHNOLOGY TOPICS to sort through in the first place ![]() |
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#13
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![]() Amberific. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 12,913 Joined: Jul 2004 Member No: 29,772 ![]() |
Well, I can see the need for a separate forum for video games, which was proposed recently, I believe. That's something that should definitely happen. But as far as I'm concerned, hardware and software are two sides of the same technology coin, and as such, cannot truly be separated.
In regards to the text that you bolded: if I acknowledged it in the first place, there's no point in reiterating it. Edit: And co-sign on what JC said. |
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#14
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,020 Joined: May 2008 Member No: 653,768 ![]() |
what would come from moderating it? more staff members? good idea bro. Bro. you want subforums? an admin can do that, but that would be retarded. Instead of having four active topics, let's make four subforums and have one active topic in each so it makes it harder for people to click, because i mean there are so many topics getting activity on a daily basis that it makes sense to scroll through. If anything, Mipadi's the tech staff, but he's an Admin so it's not really necessary to do anything about that.
But what would you moderate in tech that a normal mod couldn't take care of? Oh, you see this processor? It goes on the processor spot, don't forget a bit of paste, but NOT TOO MUCH!!!!11!!ONE! Or maybe you plug stuff into the spot it's suppoed to be plugged into. Sounds like we need a moderator for that. Maybe a moderator to give opinions, oh wait people already do that. Don't need to be a moderator to be active in the tech forum, which is OH SO ACTIVE |
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#15
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
I see everyone who posted says they're against it, but yes is in the lead.
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#16
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,020 Joined: May 2008 Member No: 653,768 ![]() |
i didnt vote. you can have 300,000,000 people vote on something, but that doesn't mean the outcome is going to be the right/logical one.
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#17
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
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*reupONtrees* |
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#18
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cost > benefit
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#19
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
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#20
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 6,349 Joined: Aug 2006 Member No: 455,274 ![]() |
Voted no. Stupid idea. I think OP just wants modding power.
Oh and OP if you wanna throw names around with attacks. You have failed miserably giving people misinformation in regards to computers. But who am I kiddin? You claim to be 15 years old and have 10 years of experience in computers. ![]() |
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#21
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![]() I'm Jc ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Mentor Posts: 13,619 Joined: Jul 2006 Member No: 437,556 ![]() |
What I was trying to say is that it's almost like people said no just for the sake of arguing with me. i don't think that's the case. because the people who have said no have all provided reasons why we don't see the necessity. we haven't just say no and moved on. if people think yes, then they should provide relevant reasons why it's needed. nobody seems to be able to provide any actual reason so far. you guys just said because you want someone who knows about technology moding it and because you want gaming/software/hardware groupings. like carrie said, you have michael as a admin who is probably the most knowledgeable about technology here even if it was necessary that someone know a lot before they could decide to move an unrelated topic out of technology and simple mod tasks like this...which it's not anyway imo. as far as subforums, a tech moderator wouldn't be responsible for creating that or even able to, that would be in the admins hands so i don't see why we need a tech staff for that either. that's a whole other request anyway though. i duno. just annoying to be accused of saying no for the sake of arguing when i'm actually giving reasons and you aren't. give reasons that make sense in regards to what mods do and i might change my mind. |
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#22
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 1,574 Joined: Aug 2007 Member No: 555,438 ![]() |
It's funny, they were going to make me one of those at one point.
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#23
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![]() Amberific. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 12,913 Joined: Jul 2004 Member No: 29,772 ![]() |
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#24
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,020 Joined: May 2008 Member No: 653,768 ![]() |
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#25
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![]() poison ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 4,806 Joined: Mar 2008 Member No: 629,020 ![]() |
I think having 1-2 people mod it isnt such a bad idea.
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#26
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,020 Joined: May 2008 Member No: 653,768 ![]() |
why though? list reasons instead of just saying YES DO IT LOL OMG HEADBANG
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#27
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 1,574 Joined: Aug 2007 Member No: 555,438 ![]() |
I think it would be a better idea if we had a technology forum where people could troubleshoot tech issues. Something similar to the design forums. If that were the case the I would say that it would be nessesary to have a tech mod, but let's face it... the technology forum is just a big happy slap discussion board.
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#28
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,020 Joined: May 2008 Member No: 653,768 ![]() |
cB isn't a tech board
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#29
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 1,574 Joined: Aug 2007 Member No: 555,438 ![]() |
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#30
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,020 Joined: May 2008 Member No: 653,768 ![]() |
exactly. correct me if i'm wrong, josh, but i kinda already said that
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#31
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![]() ٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 14,309 Joined: Nov 2004 Member No: 65,593 ![]() |
lmao @ josh thinking steven is advocating for a tech mod
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#32
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![]() Tick tock, Bill ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Administrator Posts: 8,764 Joined: Dec 2005 Member No: 333,948 ![]() |
One word: Michael (aka mipadi)
I'm willing to bet that guy has more "tech" knowledge than most of you, he just doesn't post as often. Pssssst, he's an admin. ;) Also cB isn't a tech board Then it doesn't really need a Tech mod. Edit: I voted no. It's not only unnecessary , it's superfluous. This is a general community site/forum with some areas of topic concentration. |
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#33
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Administrator Posts: 2,648 Joined: Apr 2008 Member No: 639,265 ![]() |
I'm still not really seeing the point of a Technology-only moderator. As far as closing topics, etc., goes, anyone can do that -- no need for specialized knowledge. If a regular member sees something that needs to be done, there's always the Report button anyway.
One word: Michael (aka mipadi) I'm willing to bet that guy has more "tech" knowledge than most of you, he just doesn't post as often. Pssssst, he's an admin. ;) Thanks. ![]() |
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#34
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 4,095 Joined: Jul 2005 Member No: 171,080 ![]() |
so, i was thinking looooooooooong and hard about this, AND THEN IT HIT ME...
delete the technology forum. |
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#35
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![]() Live long and prosper. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 5,525 Joined: Nov 2006 Member No: 478,024 ![]() |
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#36
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![]() DDR \\ I'm Dee :) ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Mentor Posts: 8,662 Joined: Mar 2006 Member No: 384,020 ![]() |
so, i was thinking looooooooooong and hard about this, AND THEN IT HIT ME... delete the technology forum. Should I reply like some people and just say "omg yes let's do it" with no reason why? :P I agree with the point that everyone else brought up: modding the Technology forum doesn't require any special knowledge. The only knowledge it takes is understanding of how the forums are organized. I honestly think that if we took up Josh's idea of having a Technology Help forum that it would help keep topics organized. Right now people can click on any topic that they want, but sometimes it could be misleading... if someone makes a topic about a certain computer someone might come along and want to discuss the computer and it could end up being a help topic. Technology should be there for discussion and people asking for help should have their own forum. |
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*reupONtrees* |
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#37
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#38
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
Voted no. Stupid idea. I think OP just wants modding power. Oh and OP if you wanna throw names around with attacks. You have failed miserably giving people misinformation in regards to computers. But who am I kiddin? You claim to be 15 years old and have 10 years of experience in computers. ![]() I've told you 40 f*cking times, I'm not fifteen. |
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#39
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![]() Photoartist ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 12,363 Joined: Apr 2006 Member No: 399,390 ![]() |
I dont see why yall cant be just as contributive just by being an active member in the tech forum. the only difference is moving and merging topics and some superficial member title
think u could just ask the admins for the title anyway |
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#40
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![]() I'm Jc ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Mentor Posts: 13,619 Joined: Jul 2006 Member No: 437,556 ![]() |
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#41
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
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#42
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![]() DDR \\ I'm Dee :) ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Mentor Posts: 8,662 Joined: Mar 2006 Member No: 384,020 ![]() |
Birthday 13 May 1993
![]() k, going back when this was about the tech forum not member age.... shit, I got nothing. |
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#43
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
Birthday 13 May 1993 ![]() k, going back when this was about the tech forum not member age.... shit, I got nothing. What, no, I filled my subprofile with lies. I meant my actual profile. Also, now that you mention it, I should probably change that to what it's supposed to be. Edit: I think that would make me 16 anyway. |
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#44
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![]() I'm Jc ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Mentor Posts: 13,619 Joined: Jul 2006 Member No: 437,556 ![]() |
psh, tama said you started with computers 10 years ago when you were five and instead you were seven. same difference. i was hoping you were gonna say something like you were actually 25 and we'd all be like
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#45
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![]() ٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 14,309 Joined: Nov 2004 Member No: 65,593 ![]() |
lmao @ Cj caught up on his own web of lies
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#46
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
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#47
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![]() llorT rioneS ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Human Posts: 641 Joined: Mar 2009 Member No: 717,869 ![]() |
How about Me and Buttsex as mod?
Im 14, yet. I can tell you alot. Im not like JCP bringin up questions all the time lol. |
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#48
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 6,349 Joined: Aug 2006 Member No: 455,274 ![]() |
psh, tama said you started with computers 10 years ago when you were five and instead you were seven. same difference. i was hoping you were gonna say something like you were actually 25 and we'd all be like ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() He tried tellin me that he has just as much experience in computers as me... but that he's 10 years younger than me (I'm 25, 25 - 10 = 15 years old) with the same amount of experience. So apparently he started learning computers at the age of 5 years old ![]() And now he's 17, apparently. ![]() EDIT: The funny thing is... I think he deleted or edited his post because I was tryin to find it a week ago lol |
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#49
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
He tried tellin me that he has just as much experience in computers as me... but that he's 10 years younger than me (I'm 25, 25 - 10 = 15 years old) with the same amount of experience. So apparently he started learning computers at the age of 5 years old ![]() And now he's 17, apparently. ![]() EDIT: The funny thing is... I think he deleted or edited his post because I was tryin to find it a week ago lol I was under the impression that you were closer to 30. I started tinkering with computers when I was seven. Pulling apart old computers and rebuilding them. I've rebuilt something like fifteen computers about eighty times since then. The only computers I've owned since I was 14 that I didn't build myself have been laptops. Also: I haven't deleted a post in months. I don't know why you can't find that post. Are you sure you're looking in the right topic? |
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#50
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![]() ٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 14,309 Joined: Nov 2004 Member No: 65,593 ![]() |
lmao your picture you sure look 15 though.
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#51
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
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#52
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,020 Joined: May 2008 Member No: 653,768 ![]() |
so cj, why do we need a tech moderator?
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#53
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 6,349 Joined: Aug 2006 Member No: 455,274 ![]() |
I was under the impression that you were closer to 30. I started tinkering with computers when I was seven. Pulling apart old computers and rebuilding them. I've rebuilt something like fifteen computers about eighty times since then. The only computers I've owned since I was 14 that I didn't build myself have been laptops. Also: I haven't deleted a post in months. I don't know why you can't find that post. Are you sure you're looking in the right topic? ![]() just sayin |
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#54
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
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#55
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Newbie ![]() Group: Member Posts: 6 Joined: Jun 2009 Member No: 731,575 ![]() |
I don't think that the technology subforum of this board should have a specific person moderate it. There are plenty of headstaff, admins, and people staff that can moderate in the technology subforum. Granted if it becomes more popular, and disarray it should become its own forum with specific subforums.
I voted no for a technology moderator. |
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#56
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
I don't think that the technology subforum of this board should have a specific person moderate it. There are plenty of headstaff, admins, and people staff that can moderate in the technology subforum. Granted if it becomes more popular, and disarray it should become its own forum with specific subforums. I voted no for a technology moderator. Who's alt are you? |
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#57
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![]() ٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 14,309 Joined: Nov 2004 Member No: 65,593 ![]() |
mines.
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#58
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![]() Sarcastic Mr. Know-It-All ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 2,089 Joined: Dec 2003 Member No: 29 ![]() |
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#59
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![]() /人◕‿‿◕人\ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 8,283 Joined: Dec 2007 Member No: 602,927 ![]() |
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#60
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 1,529 Joined: May 2007 Member No: 523,843 ![]() |
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#61
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,020 Joined: May 2008 Member No: 653,768 ![]() |
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*reupONtrees* |
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#62
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obviously hes gonna say something dumb like," seemed like a great idea even if it wasn't me doing the moderating." which is bullshit cause he really does want to go on a power trip
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#63
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Staff Alumni Posts: 7,020 Joined: May 2008 Member No: 653,768 ![]() |
He'll probably say something "clever" to refute your comment, as well. Probably mine too, or maybe he'll say something like he doesn't even care or that we're trying too hard.
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#64
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![]() (′ ・ω・`) ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Designer Posts: 6,179 Joined: Dec 2004 Member No: 72,477 ![]() |
lol freaking mean.
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#65
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 1,574 Joined: Aug 2007 Member No: 555,438 ![]() |
He'll probably say something "clever" to refute your comment, as well. Probably mine too, or maybe he'll say something like he doesn't even care or that we're trying too hard. I wish people would refute my comments. :( PS: I didn't think that you were in favor of this. I was just using our conversation to prove a point to everyone else. That we really don't need a tech mod as this is not a tech board. |
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#66
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![]() Senior Member ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Official Member Posts: 6,349 Joined: Aug 2006 Member No: 455,274 ![]() |
That ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
now please close this useless, shitty, thread. |
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#67
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![]() DDR \\ I'm Dee :) ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Mentor Posts: 8,662 Joined: Mar 2006 Member No: 384,020 ![]() |
We kinda did something to the Technology forum.
http://www.createblog.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=232472 |
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