Jews, Muslims, and Christians? Rating Options

[Mikeplyts]

Who's right?



I was studying this today and got interested in it but I'm just wondering, whose land is it? Who do Christians "support" the most? Does the Bible have any relation to the Muslim or Jewish "Book"? (Sorry, forgot their names).

[illriginal]

Jews and Muslims.. and Christians in the Middle East, Orthodox / Greek Orthodox Christians that is.


Islam: Quran

Christianity: Bible

Judaism: Torah

[heyo-captain-jac...]

Add more.

None of them are right.

[illriginal]

Meh take the Quranic challenge, then prove it's not right.

I've enjoyed watching scholars, historians, and scientists drop to their knees and do their Salat, the first Pillar, their submission to Allah's will

[karmakiller]

Who's right?
I was studying this today and got interested in it but I'm just wondering, whose land is it? Who do Christians "support" the most? Does the Bible have any relation to the Muslim or Jewish "Book"? (Sorry, forgot their names).

IMO, you should take a Philosophy class. Religions have a lot of depth and it would take a lot of replies and conflicting opinions for you to fully understand the differences. None of our opinions can fully be objective.

[illriginal]

Ew... just not too much philosophy. Now a days people simply get deep into philosophy only to follow it as if it's literally a religion of its own. When in reality it's just the mentality of said author.

[Superase]

The utlimate question! I would have to say none of them are right. Each of those books are not and will never be the original, manual on how to live to life. Each book, the bible, quran, and torah have been adjusted to what the people making the first print liked. And those were men.
I've never been really to into religion, but when I started taking all these history classes in college it opened my eyes and so i became a deist. One of my teachers explained it to me in simple terms, you believe in a god but not organized religion.

[illriginal]

lol... you're kidding right? Just because the Bible has been perverted over the centuries DEFINITELY does not mean that the Qur'an and the Torah have been. Unless of course you have some proof. I beg for that proof. In fact, if you can prove that the Qur'an itself has been tainted, I'll become an atheist right now.

[PurpleDaze112]

My question is that if a god is so wonderful and so loving, why is the world such a miserable place? Why do some people get love, or money, or happiness while others are born without eyes or die becaue their mothers can't porduce enough breast milk to feed them? Why are israeli troops allowed to murder innocnet palestinian three and seven year old sisters in front of their pleading grandmother and not be punished for it because no one else in the world really gives a shit?

When jesus or god or allah can tell me that, I'll put aside my pretences and follow him.

[heyo-captain-jac...]

lol... you're kidding right? Just because the Bible has been perverted over the centuries DEFINITELY does not mean that the Qur'an and the Torah have been. Unless of course you have some proof. I beg for that proof. In fact, if you can prove that the Qur'an itself has been tainted, I'll become an atheist right now.

That's a hell of a bet you've got going there.

Corruption is everywhere. It fills everything, including the Bible, Qur'an, and the Torah. And it doesn't stop there. It never stops.

[illriginal]

That's a hell of a bet you've got going there.

Corruption is everywhere. It fills everything, including the Bible, Qur'an, and the Torah. And it doesn't stop there. It never stops.

People who mistranslated 1 word in the Qur'an were beheaded. The Qur'an was reviewed by thousands upon thousands of Scholars. There's not one mistranslation in the Qur'an. In fact, if you read the Qur'an in Arabic... it's like reading an on going poem. It is beautifully flawless as you can sing the Qur'an. In fact the Qur'an is so poetic that it can easily be memorized. I've already memorized about 70% of the Qur'an. And plus there's too much science in the Qur'an for me to think it is not the Word of God :)

[heyo-captain-jac...]

That sounds like corruption to me.

[illriginal]

How... corruption killed corruption? No... anyways, prove the Qur'an wrong.

[heyo-captain-jac...]

No, not corruption killed corruption.

"People who mistranslated 1 word in the Qur'an were beheaded."

Does that sound like anything humans should do?

[illriginal]

Yes. It is mandatory. To have the balls to pervert the Word of God is not worth living as those perverted words can ruin the purity of generations to come. They deserve centuries worth of punishment. Beheading is too kind.

[Superase]

lol... you're kidding right? Just because the Bible has been perverted over the centuries DEFINITELY does not mean that the Qur'an and the Torah have been. Unless of course you have some proof. I beg for that proof. In fact, if you can prove that the Qur'an itself has been tainted, I'll become an atheist right now.

Ok well when the last prophet left, Muhammad, he did not leave the Quran written, but by word of mouth. And everyone knows that when things are only spoken that they will get messed up. It wasn't till quite a bit later that some MEN sat down and tried to piece together what they believe to be real. Just by that, that will question anyone's faith.

[illriginal]

Ok well when the last prophet left, Muhammad, he did not leave the Quran written, but by word of mouth. And everyone knows that when things are only spoken that they will get messed up. It wasn't till quite a bit later that some MEN sat down and tried to piece together what they believe to be real. Just by that, that will question anyone's faith.

No... they did not TRY to piece it together lol... it is like a poem. How can you change the wordage of a poem without making the poem seem distorted in any way?...


One mistranslated word would easily break the poem or the chain of words which creates the poem. In fact right now if you handed a Muslim scholar a Qur'an with just 1 word replaced by another, he could easily tell without looking at another Qur'an because it won't make sense. Everything in the Qur'an is on a mathematical level.

[Superase]

No... they did not TRY to piece it together lol... it is like a poem. How can you change the wordage of a poem without making the poem seem distorted in any way?...
One mistranslated word would easily break the poem or the chain of words which creates the poem. In fact right now if you handed a Muslim scholar a Qur'an with just 1 word replaced by another, he could easily tell without looking at another Qur'an because it won't make sense. Everything in the Qur'an is on a mathematical level.

If you're looking at these holy books in a Poetic way then, a poem can mean one thing to one person and another to one. Any historial can simply tell you that no one is sure about whether the three main holy books are correct or not.
I guess what i'm trying to say that as simple human beings that we will never know what is truely Gods words maybe we find out when we die or something. Religion is one thing that no one will ever agree on.

[illriginal]

If you're looking at these holy books in a Poetic way then, a poem can mean one thing to one person and another to one. Any historial can simply tell you that no one is sure about whether the three main holy books are correct or not.
I guess what i'm trying to say that as simple human beings that we will never know what is truely Gods words maybe we find out when we die or something. Religion is one thing that no one will ever agree on.

Thus is why the Qur'an has a partner. It's called, the Hadiths. lol

Just like the Torah has the Talmud.


Like I've mentioned before, take the Qur'an challenge.


And if it makes you feel all warm inside to believe no one will ever agree on Religion, that's ok. But fact of the matter, you're gonna have to deal with the fact that Christianity, Judaism, and Islam will NEVER be abolished. And it is strongly commanded by God to unite and kill all non-believers who attempt to threaten our right to exist.

[Superase]

Thus is why the Qur'an has a partner. It's called, the Hadiths. lol

Just like the Torah has the Talmud.
Like I've mentioned before, take the Qur'an challenge.
And if it makes you feel all warm inside to believe no one will ever agree on Religion, that's ok. But fact of the matter, you're gonna have to deal with the fact that Christianity, Judaism, and Islam will NEVER be abolished. And it is strongly commanded by God to unite and kill all non-believers who attempt to threaten our right to exist.

What quran challenge?
So its commanded by god to kill all his non-believers, i believe there is a god, i just don't think that you need an organized religion to do so. If we were supposed to kill everyone that didn't believe in him...that would be alot of people...

[illriginal]

What quran challenge?
So its commanded by god to kill all his non-believers,

Non-believers who threaten the existence of submitters or Christians, Muslims, and Jews.

As for the Qur'anic Challenge, you can start here: http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Miracle/

http://www.khilafah.com/index.php/concepts...urans-challenge

And if you're interested: http://www.miraclesofthequran.com/film.html

Even scientists and scholars have openly admitted that the Qur'an has to be the word of God as majority of the things learned in the Qur'an cannot have been through human intervention.


If you're courageous enough to take the challenge, let me know

[abrahamseed]

My God is the God of Abraham, my church is Jesus Christ, Him crucified and risen.

The earth and everything in it is corrupt thanks to satan.

My God made it so easy to get to heaven that you don't have to memorize a book, and there is nothing you can do to earn it...it was freely given...through the blood of Christ.

The whole old testament pointed toward it, and the whole new testament points back to it...the death and resurrection of Christ...and because He lives...we live.

My God made it that easy because human beings would never be able to stand in His presence without the blood of Jesus washing over them, and we certainly would never make it on our own....don't try so hard to complicate it....He made it easy because He wanted us all to be able to make it.

[heyo-captain-jac...]

Yes. It is mandatory. To have the balls to pervert the Word of God is not worth living as those perverted words can ruin the purity of generations to come. They deserve centuries worth of punishment. Beheading is too kind.

You're f*cking barbaric.

If you're courageous enough to take the challenge, let me know

Nobody is taking it. Nobody cares.

[-DressYourEyelid...]

i guess illriginal wouldn't approve that i'm a practicing pagan...

religion is man made. everything man makes or touches is flawed in some way. in that sense, i view every religion as wrong, but i'm not going to judge anyone for their practices and beliefs, nor am i going to view my religion as superior. no one will ever know which religion is closest to being right. if there is a "loving" god out there, i have a hard time believing he'll punish people because of the religion they chose to practice or grew up with.

this was kinda a silly question, actually. there's no right answer.

[Uronacid]

this was nor am i going to view my religion as superior.

In this sentence you imply that you believe in a religion. If you believe in a religion then there is a "right" answer. Your own. If you believe your religion is not superior, is "wrong", and is man made then why do you practice it at all? Just food for thought.

Anyway, I'm a Christian. I believe my religion is "right". Why? For various reasons, but ultimately because I believe in it. I don't try and convince people to become a christian. Religion isn't a product and doesn't need to be sold. It's something that people need to discover on their own.

[-DressYourEyelid...]

In this sentence you imply that you believe in a religion. If you believe in a religion then there is a "right" answer. Your own. If you believe your religion is not superior, is "wrong", and is man made then why do you practice it at all? Just food for thought.

sorry, i didn't exactly word that right. i meant that all religions are imperfect.

i practice a religion even with the knowledge that it is most likely wrong because it it best suits my lifestyle, ethics and conscience.

[kryogenix]

sorry, i didn't exactly word that right. i meant that all religions are imperfect.

i practice a religion even with the knowledge that it is most likely wrong because it it best suits my lifestyle, ethics and conscience.

That's incredibly stupid.

Why follow something that you claim to know is not the absolute truth? You're basically saying you're living a lie. You are an adherent out of convenience, not because you believe.

[-DressYourEyelid...]

That's incredibly stupid.

Why follow something that you claim to know is not the absolute truth? You're basically saying you're living a lie. You are an adherent out of convenience, not because you believe.

because i'm not a pompous ***hole who is naive and closed minded enough to believe that every religion other than my own will give anyone practicing so a one way ticket to damnation.

and religion is all about convenience. faith is not. they're different things entirely.

[Uronacid]

because i'm not a pompous ***hole who is naive and closed minded enough to believe that every religion other than my own will give anyone practicing so a one way ticket to damnation.

and religion is all about convenience. faith is not. they're different things entirely.

I don't believe that you're pompous, naive, or closed minded when you believe that one religion is better than another. I don't mind individuals who practice other religions. As Christians we're to love everyone regardless of their religion. If your religion states that worshiping another God is a "one way ticket to damnation" then so be it. That doesn't mean I'm going to shove Christianity down their throat. I'm going to love them during their time spent on earth.

Religion is not about convenience. It is about faith. In order to truly follow a religion you need to have faith and believe in its teachings. Practicing a religion is utterly pointless if you don't believe in it. Why do anything that you don't believe in?

I have to agree with kyro on this. You can only be so open-minded before you become a boring idiot who just aims to please in order to avoid conflict. Having beliefs does not make you close minded. It makes you an individual. Just don't be a dick about it.

[kryogenix]

because i'm not a pompous ***hole who is naive and closed minded enough to believe that every religion other than my own will give anyone practicing so a one way ticket to damnation.

No, but you're foolish enough to believe that you're open minded when you hold religious beliefs that are mutually exclusive to other religious beliefs. By accepting one belief as absolute truth, you are rejecting any contradictory beliefs.

Or are you saying that you believe that no one is right? Then what's the point of religion at all?

and religion is all about convenience. faith is not. they're different things entirely.

Tell that to these people. I'm sure being burned on crosses and being fed to lions was their idea of holding beliefs out of convenience.

[mipadi]

Tell that to these people. I'm sure being burned on crosses and being fed to lions was their idea of holding beliefs out of convenience.

http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/4987/th...martyrslast.jpg

Historical context. In all fairness, that was from a completely different time, when people thought about religion in a completely different way. As Nietzsche said, "Gott ist tot. Und wir haben ihn getötet."

[Uronacid]

Historical context. In all fairness, that was from a completely different time, when people thought about religion in a completely different way. As Nietzsche said, "Gott ist tot. Und wir haben ihn getötet."

Just because we don't have to worry about being burned at the stake anymore doesn't mean we don't take our religion seriously. I'm 100% sure that there are many individuals who would burn at the stake before renouncing their beliefs in this day and age as well. While religion has become a joke for most people. Nietzsche was clearly being over dramatic when he said that. To this day there are still many people who truly are religious.

I've been ridiculed for my faith plenty of times. I've learned a valuable lesson as a result:

"Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him." - Prvb 26:4

[mipadi]

Nietzsche was clearly being over dramatic when he said that.

Nietzsche may have spoken aphoristically, but I don't think he was being overly dramatic. He was making a careful observation that in the modern world, even people who are devout don't believe in God (or gods) the same way that people did once upon a time.

[Uronacid]

Nietzsche may have spoken aphoristically, but I don't think he was being overly dramatic. He was making a careful observation that in the modern world, even people who are devout don't believe in God (or gods) the same way that people did once upon a time.

Shouting "God is Dead." and "We have killed him." are hardly a careful statements to make. We simply do not react to religion the same way because we have no fear of persecution. Choosing a religion just doesn't put your life at risk anymore therefore there is a greater percentage of less serious followers in each religion.

[kryogenix]

Historical context. In all fairness, that was from a completely different time, when people thought about religion in a completely different way. As Nietzsche said, "Gott ist tot. Und wir haben ihn getötet."

Still, there are many practices I wouldn't call convenient. Praying to Mecca every afternoon, keeping kosher, hauling your ass early in the morning to wherever your place of worship is, etc. Anything with self denial isn't something I'd consider being done out of convenience. Maybe if you were a fatty and decided to convert to Hinduism to lose weight or something.

[mipadi]

Shouting "God is Dead." and "We have killed him." are hardly a careful statements to make.

He didn't shout it, he wrote it -- as part of a much larger treatise.

We simply do not react to religion the same way because we have no fear of persecution. Choosing a religion just doesn't put your life at risk anymore therefore there is a greater percentage of less serious followers in each religion.

You seem to have just reiterated Nietzsche's point.

[Uronacid]

He didn't shout it, he wrote it -- as part of a much larger treatise.
You seem to have just reiterated Nietzsche's point.

I haven't reiterated Nietzsche's point. I've been pretty mild in what I've said. Again, he was too extreme regarding the subject. Yes there are people that do not take religion seriously (dressyoureyelids is a clear example of this), however there are still many devote followers of religion.

Anything with self denial isn't something I'd consider being done out of convenience.

Agreed

[mipadi]

I haven't reiterated Nietzsche's point. I've been much more mild in my statement. Again, he was too extreme regarding the subject. Yes there are people that do not take religion seriously (dressyoureyelids is a clear example of this), however there are still many devote followers of religion.

It's not a matter of whether people still take religion seriously or not. The point is that even people who claim to take religion seriously don't take it seriously in the same sense as people hundreds of years ago.

In what way was he too extreme?

[Uronacid]

It's not a matter of whether people still take religion seriously or not. The point is that even people who claim to take religion seriously don't take it seriously in the same sense as people hundreds of years ago.

In what way was he too extreme?

He's generalizing. There will always be black sheep. People who clain to be serious and fail when their tested. On the other hand, there are still people today who take it just as seriously as people hundreds of years ago.