Supporting the Troops End the War Options

[Kontroll]

It baffles me when I see these bumper stickers that say 'Support the Troops End the War.' Is that really supporting the troops? Also, we are not in a war right now. We are in a conflict. Congress never declared war on Iraq, Afganistan, or any other countries since 9.11.

The mentality of the men and women in the service is so extreme, especially in the army and marines, that anyone whose never experienced it, really has no say that has any value. It's like a gym teacher trying to teach philosophy. You have to understand that most of the soldiers in Iraq or any other neighboring countries wanted to be there. That's why they signed up. They are taught to be prepared at all times to go to war. It's a soldiers profession to kill. It's their mission.

Saying that, if we don't support their mission, how can we support the people that are carrying it out? It doesn't make any sense. If you've got people back home saying that the war is stupid and wrong, then that is affecting the soldiers because now they have their leaders telling them what they need to do, and others telling them it's wrong. If anything, we should support the conflict.

That's the great thing about a voluntary military. No one forces you to join. And if some body does force you, then it's your fault that you went forth and gave the oath. They ask you right then and there if anyone is forcing you to join, speak now.

In conclusion, those opposed to the current conflict are only creating more damage to society and other societies. If we have any chance of getting out of the Middle East any faster the best thing to do is support our President and his choices. That's how our country made it through WWII. People decided to participate by building weapons and giving food to the troops. They donated money. Until Pearl Harbor we shouldn't have had any involvement, but the American citizens decided that it would be in the best interest to do something instead of talking about it negatively.

Please give me your comments.

[*Steven*]

Actually, war hasn't been declared since WWII.

[Kontroll]

Well, thank you for the clarity.

[*Steven*]

Just supporting your point.

I agree with you, but I don't think society (any time soon) will come to the realization that everyone opposing everything (as if it's the latest and greatest fad) only makes matters worse.

[*karmakiller*]

It reminds me of when I driving around with one my brother's friends, who's a former Marine, and was in Fallujah, and some guy in front of us had that "Freedom isn't Free" bumper sticker and he said "what has he paid?".

I do think that you can support the troops, but not support the "mission". They're two different things and you shouldn't let the line blur. Don't say that you are supporting the troops by not supporting what they're doing.

[Kontroll]

I do think that you can support the troops, but not support the "mission". They're two different things and you shouldn't let the line blur. Don't say that you are supporting the troops by not supporting what they're doing.

That's basically what I'm saying. Don't say that you're supporting the troops if you don't support the mission. It looks like that's what you just said.

[jammylise]

I kinda support your opinion on this.
But when you said it hasn't been declared
a war, doesn't mean it's not a war.
My brother showed me videos of not even half the stuff
he went through in Iraq for a year and a half.
Don't you think it is sort of a war, when people are
killing eachother every single day to keep the United States
safe?

[War: the waging of armed conflict against an enemy; ]

It is a war, it just hasn't been declared an offical one.

I support the troops who risk their lives

It's not ALL there pro choice to go
Some of them go into the military, because
it pays for some college, gives them a place to live.

My brothers friend went in, because he got kicked out of his house, didn't have money for college, and no place to stay.

i'm not saying the "war" is right, having all those troops killed,
but its life. It does suck, but if they do die, they died fighting for our country. They died with pride.

I respect what you wrote above, i'm just simply giving my comments.

[*Steven*]

That's basically what I'm saying. Don't say that you're supporting the troops if you don't support the mission. It looks like that's what you just said.

I didn't intend it to come out that way. I fully support the military and everything it's doing. I'm a bit of a pro-military nut, taken 4 years rotc, lots of family in military, etc etc. Even if I didn't support what's going on in Iraq, I still think it would be stupid to pull out because it would show the rest of the world that we can be pushed around and will eventually run away with our tails tucked.

[jesusisthebestth...]

war is defined as a conflict carried on by force of arms, as between nations or between parties within a nation; warfare, as by land, sea, or air.

therefore, one can support the troops and want to end the war. you can support the troops by stating that you want the war to end. there are several soldiers/troops who do not believe in the war. by speaking out against the war some are voicing the opinions many troops are afraid to voice.

if everyone held your point of view then there would be no point in living in america. two of the "best" things about this country are freedom of speech and freedom of press. both of which allow citizens and non citizens to voice their grievances against the president, as well as praise him and his efforts.

WWII is completely different from the war on iraq...you cannot compare the war on iraq with WWII because the world and its individual nation states were combatting completely different issues.

[*Steven*]

I don't care what the hell the definition as you say it is, it's a fact that war has not been declared by congress since world war 2.

[faydedprimadonna]

i definately don't agree with the "conflict", i don't think we should still be over there, but i have nothing but love and respect for our troops over there... my brother is a marine, one of my best friends just got back from camp taji a couple days ago... i think that you can disagree with the "conflict" but still support the troops... you don't have to be pro-war to show some brave people love and support!

[Amaranthus]

You could support the troops by caring for their general welfare and health. Not necessarily by wanting to send them home, or send more in. Correspondence is a form of support as well.

[*karmakiller*]

That's basically what I'm saying. Don't say that you're supporting the troops if you don't support the mission. It looks like that's what you just said.

Well, what I said is that you can support the troops if you don't support the mission.

[*Steven*]

i definately don't agree with the "conflict", i don't think we should still be over there, but i have nothing but love and respect for our troops over there... my brother is a marine, one of my best friends just got back from camp taji a couple days ago... i think that you can disagree with the "conflict" but still support the troops... you don't have to be pro-war to show some brave people love and support!

Well, what I said is that you can support the troops if you don't support the mission.

But then the troops get the sense that they're fighting for something that their country doesn't want, and if they get demoralized, that's the worst possible thing that can happen to them.

[faydedprimadonna]

But then the troops get the sense that they're fighting for something that their country doesn't want, and if they get demoralized, that's the worst possible thing that can happen to them.

at least from my experience with the soldiers that i know, they're there for one or both of 2 reasons... the paycheck and/or courage of conviction... if they're only there because it's a well paying job, then they don't really care why they're there or how the country feels about the conflict... if it's a courage of their convictions, then they shouldn't mind what people are saying about the conflict anyway because they believe in what it is that they're doing...

i believe that alot of the controversy about "support the troops, end the war" is based on america's reactions from vietnam... americans don't want to be somewhere we don't belong and get shat on for it and the troops don't want to come home to boos and protests... you DON'T have to agree with the country's decision to b involved in the middle east, but at least have the common courtesy to support the people that are keeping the draft from happening...

[*Steven*]

Draft won't happen. America is becoming too pussy-like. They would try some stupid shit like offering amnesty to illegals who joined the military.

You may know a few troops, but I hardly think that speaks for the armed forces. I've spent plenty of time on many bases, many filled with troops destined to Iraq. I spent four years in ROTC. I know a lot of people in the military. A lot of them go in because they're gung ho about joining the military, about fighting for the country. Yes, there are some who join for the paycheck, free college, bettering their lives, but a lot of people join because they want to fight for the country.

[faydedprimadonna]

i wasn't trying to sound like an expert on the subject, that was just the perspective i've gained from some of the people i know... i'm hoping that the draft won't ever happen again, but i can't trust that it won't if another republican gets his hands on the country

[*Steven*]

Lololololol. You're media brainwashed.

Actually I can't say that for certain, it just sounds that way, the way you pinned sole responsibility on the republicans. The Republicans are also causing global warming, and they create tsunami's so Bush can put our troops on asian soil. Anyways, sorry to come off as rude if I am, I don't mean it that way, it's just this is a subject that I stand very firm on.

[*superstitious*]

But then the troops get the sense that they're fighting for something that their country doesn't want, and if they get demoralized, that's the worst possible thing that can happen to them.

Understood. But just to play devil's advocate for sec here, if you are against the war, but do not wish to dampen the spirits of the troops, should you lie to keep their spirits up? Should you give false hope (if you truly believe that it is a lost cause?)

I understand the sentimentality of condemning the war, not the men fighting the war. I just don't know how one would find a balanced way of doing both.

[faydedprimadonna]

Lololololol. You're media brainwashed.

Actually I can't say that for certain, it just sounds that way, the way you pinned sole responsibility on the republicans. The Republicans are also causing global warming, and they create tsunami's so Bush can put our troops on asian soil. Anyways, sorry to come off as rude if I am, I don't mean it that way, it's just this is a subject that I stand very firm on.

i don't think you're rude at all... everyone has a right to their own opinion... i'm not trying to convert anyone... as to being media brainwashed, i may be... i don't blame republicans for everything but i do believe that a democrat would have ended this conflict already... it's probably due to the fact that i'm a hardcore masshole

Understood. But just to play devil's advocate for sec here, if you are against the war, but do not wish to dampen the spirits of the troops, should you lie to keep their spirits up? Should you give false hope (if you truly believe that it is a lost cause?)

that's the true dilemma i think... if the majority of america is against the conflict, then should the soldiers be lied to about it? i feel for the men and women over there, but the sooner this shit ends, the better...

[*Steven*]

Understood. But just to play devil's advocate for sec here, if you are against the war, but do not wish to dampen the spirits of the troops, should you lie to keep their spirits up? Should you give false hope (if you truly believe that it is a lost cause?)

I understand the sentimentality of condemning the war, not the men fighting the war. I just don't know how one would find a balanced way of doing both.

Hmmmm.
I don't think you should lie, because when the troops find out (and they will) they won't be very happy with that. It's situational, as to what to do. I think in the current situation, we need to get people back home to stop expressing all the negativities making the troops feel like they're fighting a war that they don't want to be in for a country that doesn't think they're supposed to be there in the first place.

I know times have changed, but 70 years back, if the country went to war, everyone pitched in, be it taking up jobs to help produce machinery, fighting on the front line, being a nurse, whatever. The country supported itself, and didn't have all the inner conflict that causes such wishy washy decisions and lack of confidence or unanimity.

It's late, and I'm rambling, so I'm not sure if what I just said made sense, or if I even completed the thought that I was thinking. If I didn't, oops :( I'll finish it tomorrow in between classes.

[faydedprimadonna]

I know times have changed, but 70 years back, if the country went to war, everyone pitched in, be it taking up jobs to help produce machinery, fighting on the front line, being a nurse, whatever. The country supported itself, and didn't have all the inner conflict that causes such wishy washy decisions and lack of confidence or unanimity.

ahhh... that was a simpler time... a time i wish could be resurrected! it's true that alot has changed... there's too much going on in america that's depressing me right now... i'm not even sure that what we have is worth fighting for...(STOP!! i am NOT a commie bastard... i love this country, i'm just disappointed in what it's become at the moment...) however!! the thing that IS worth fighting for is the country that we want it to become... we should be worrying about bettering our own country before trying to better the others!! AMERICA SHOULD NOT BE MOMMY TO THE REST OF THE WORLD!

[*karmakiller*]

I know times have changed, but 70 years back, if the country went to war, everyone pitched in, be it taking up jobs to help produce machinery, fighting on the front line, being a nurse, whatever. The country supported itself, and didn't have all the inner conflict that causes such wishy washy decisions and lack of confidence or unanimity.

Yes, but, back then we declared war

I suppose you could go deeper and see what everyone's idea of "supporting" the troops is. I don't think I've seen anyone actually supporting them, besides giving them moral support and sending them goods and such. I mean, hanging a flag in your front yard doesn't count as supporting the troops; that's just patriotism.

I deffinately wouldn't lie to them and act like I supported it. My brother's on his second tour and he knows that I'm not for the "conflict", but he also knows that I support and care about him. He has to do what he's told and I'm always here to try to keep his spirits as high as I can. That would fall under the moral support.

[Kontroll]

Alright, all I'm really getting is the same thing. Yes, you can support the troops by not supporting the mission. Why though? I gave a logical explination. It's time to hear the rebuttle.

Jammylise: Okay, Yes, according to your definition, we are in a war, but for the United States to enter into war, Congress needs to declare war on a country first. So, technically we are only in a conflict.

SoEffinMajor: Tell me logically how that stands up? Wanting the war to end, but supporting the troops? What does it do for the soldiers? How does it improve our country? Why should I care about what you're saying? < That's just a real question. Not being disrespectful.

[jammylise]

Alright, all I'm really getting is the same thing. Yes, you can support the troops by not supporting the mission. Why though? I gave a logical explination. It's time to hear the rebuttle.

Jammylise: Okay, Yes, according to your definition, we are in a war, but for the United States to enter into war, Congress needs to declare war on a country first. So, technically we are only in a conflict.

SoEffinMajor: Tell me logically how that stands up? Wanting the war to end, but supporting the troops? What does it do for the soldiers? How does it improve our country? Why should I care about what you're saying? < That's just a real question. Not being disrespectful.

I understand i'm just going by how my friends/ex boyfriend/ and family
feel as well as how i feel.

because my mom grew up in the army bases her father and rest of the guys in the family were in the military
my cousins are in the military, my sister grew up on the military base
my sisters husband is in the army
my brother is in the Marines

& so on and so on lol.

i'm just saying, try telling one of our troops in iraq suffering, without baths, good food, hardly any water, hard heat, rockets almost hitting or hitting them, bombs being blown up, hummvs blown up to pieces, loosing loved ones, carrying fallen troops that are dead hand and hand, blood in there face, with heart aches, that we are not in war.

:(

but i know its not correct that it's a war, but it is in some way, just not offical.

[Kontroll]

I understand i'm just going by how my friends/ex boyfriend/ and family
feel as well as how i feel.

because my mom grew up in the army bases her father and rest of the guys in the family were in the military
my cousins are in the military, my sister grew up on the military base
my sisters husband is in the army
my brother is in the Marines

& so on and so on lol.

i'm just saying, try telling one of our troops in iraq suffering, without baths, good food, hardly any water, hard heat, rockets almost hitting or hitting them, bombs being blown up, hummvs blown up to pieces, loosing loved ones, carrying fallen troops that are dead hand and hand, blood in there face, with heart aches, that we are not in war.

:(

but i know its not correct that it's a war, but it is in some way, just not offical.

what am I suppost to be telling them? My point was that in order to support the troops we must support their mission. That's it. I don't know why everyone is getting into all these different tangents.

I'm not saying that being in the military is easy, because it's not. I'll be the first one to tell you that.

[bat19]

^go back to the navy you flag hugging repulican

f**k you, I wont do what you tell me
No matter how hard you try you cant stop us now
There is no other pill to take so swallow the one that makes you ill
They dont got to burn the books, they just remove em'
Whatcha say, whatcha say, whatcha say, what!

IMAGE REMOVED.

Whooohhoooo!!! America sucks!! Lets all move to Canada!!

This post has been edited by karmakiller: Aug 31 2007, 12:33 AM

[faydedprimadonna]

wow... what's with the cock-fest there...

anyway... it really makes me depressed to hear all these young kids saying f**k america, move to canada/europe/whatever... of course this country's gonna suck if you just f**king desert it! what ever happened to making a stand and turning things around? how is it ever going to get better if everyone emmigrates? anything worth having is worth fighting for, and a better america is worth fighting for... i just think we're on the wrong battlefield at the moment... we should be blowing up mexico and brazil and possibly bulgaria...

[bat19]

^Anyone who knows me knows I was just joking. I don't hate America, but I dont love it either. It has many, many, many faults and the idea of most Americans that we are the greatest country in the world is just ridiculous.

I support the troops but not their mission, and it's a mistake to believe them to be the same thing. I support all soldiers, I think it's an honor-worthy position, especially now since it has become 100% voluntary. I respect any man who is willing to die for what they believe in, even terrorists. One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.

I'm going to make a prediction of the oncoming years. We will pull out of the middle-east after a nine-month long standstill. After a few months of deliberation, we will announce war on China. However our troop numbers will have reached an all time low and the draft will take effect again after the institution of martial law.

Now the fact that many Americans no longer support the war may have a negative effect on the morale of the soldiers over there now. I'd like to believe that the scorching hot temperatures and the constant mental and physical fatigue just might have more of an impact than we at home.

As far as "member-bashing" Jake, f uck him, he's an Irish pissant. But he's also one of my best friends and I can say whatever the fu ck I want to say to him, and this includes derogatory statements. In fact, most of the statements I make to Jake are derogatory statements. I'm also not sure how calling him a "flag-hugging Republican" counts as bashing. Connect the dots for me there. He is a flag-hugging republican and he'll be the first to admit it.

Now I'm rollin' down Rodeo with a shotgun. These people ain't seen a brown-skinned man since they grandparents bought one.

[faydedprimadonna]

^Anyone who knows me knows I was just joking. I don't hate America, but I dont love it either. It has many, many, many faults and the idea of most Americans that we are the greatest country in the world is just ridiculous.

ok... i'm still kinda new here, so i don't know everyone's little nuances... where i live, there's sooo many kids that are just so apathetic about the state of this country and they're serious about just letting it rot because it's the easy thing to do, it's hard to see when someone's just being sarcastic... i agree 100% with the rest of that tho!!

I support the troops but not their mission, and it's a mistake to believe them to be the same thing. I support all soldiers, I think it's an honor-worthy position, especially now since it has become 100% voluntary. I respect any man who is willing to die for what they believe in, even terrorists. One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.

also... i agree 100%

I'm going to make a prediction of the oncoming years. We will pull out of the middle-east after a nine-month long standstill. After a few months of deliberation, we will announce war on China. However our troop numbers will have reached an all time low and the draft will take effect again after the institution of martial law.

i kinda like the idea of martial law, but china? seriously... i thought it was one of the koreas we were going after... the north i think? with all the wmd's... and f**k the draft... i really might emmigrate if that shit happens...

Now the fact that many Americans no longer support the war may have a negative effect on the morale of the soldiers over there now. I'd like to believe that the scorching hot temperatures and the constant mental and physical fatigue just might have more of an impact than we at home.

agree...

As far as "member-bashing" Jake, f uck him, he's an Irish pissant. But he's also one of my best friends and I can say whatever the fu ck I want to say to him, and this includes derogatory statements. In fact, most of the statements I make to Jake are derogatory statements. I'm also not sure how calling him a "flag-hugging Republican" counts as bashing. Connect the dots for me there. He is a flag-hugging republican and he'll be the first to admit it.

i don't think i said anything about that i don't think that "flag-hugging republican" is an awful thing to say to someone you can bash whoever you want!

Now I'm rollin' down Rodeo with a shotgun. These people ain't seen a brown-skinned man since they grandparents bought one.

random...

[Kontroll]

^Anyone who knows me knows I was just joking. I don't hate America, but I dont love it either. It has many, many, many faults and the idea of most Americans that we are the greatest country in the world is just ridiculous.

I support the troops but not their mission, and it's a mistake to believe them to be the same thing. I support all soldiers, I think it's an honor-worthy position, especially now since it has become 100% voluntary. I respect any man who is willing to die for what they believe in, even terrorists. One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.

I'm going to make a prediction of the oncoming years. We will pull out of the middle-east after a nine-month long standstill. After a few months of deliberation, we will announce war on China. However our troop numbers will have reached an all time low and the draft will take effect again after the institution of martial law.

Now the fact that many Americans no longer support the war may have a negative effect on the morale of the soldiers over there now. I'd like to believe that the scorching hot temperatures and the constant mental and physical fatigue just might have more of an impact than we at home.

As far as "member-bashing" Jake, f uck him, he's an Irish pissant. But he's also one of my best friends and I can say whatever the fu ck I want to say to him, and this includes derogatory statements. In fact, most of the statements I make to Jake are derogatory statements. I'm also not sure how calling him a "flag-hugging Republican" counts as bashing. Connect the dots for me there. He is a flag-hugging republican and he'll be the first to admit it.

Now I'm rollin' down Rodeo with a shotgun. These people ain't seen a brown-skinned man since they grandparents bought one.

Without troops there would be no mission. Troop are the mission. You cannot separate them, unless we have robots. And we don't have robots like that.

I feel that you're right to a point about we at home not supporting the troops having an effect on them. But what do you think a major part of that metal fatigue is? Family. The people back home. Yes, it is also the disturbing images of people's body parts flying in every which direction. Blood spraying all over your face. People getting slowly getting crushed by tanks and screaming for some one to save them until it runs over their lungs. Yes, but family is also a major factor of mental fatigue.

We are the greatest country in the world, but with many flaws. Why else would every body want to come here to live? Secondly, what do you mean 'especially now that it is 100% voluntary?' The army has always been voluntary. There's only been one draft, and do you think that might have been the reason why we lost that conflict?

[*Steven*]

Not to be a pain in the ass or something, but there's been a few drafts

Vietnam
Korea
The World Wars
Civil War
Tried during the War of 1812, but failed.

[*karmakiller*]

Well if the people are the mission, like how you say that the troops are the mission. Wouldn't it be better to say that the government are the mission. Seeing as they are the ones who decide who to invade and how to invade and when to invade? They're closer to the mission than the troops, because they're the ones who put it together and decide upon it. Not the troops. It's kinda like "don't shoot the messenger"; they're just carrying out their orders.

[NoSex]

Die for Oil Sucker.

"We support our troops most because we say, 'Bring them home!'
So say 'no' to army, air force, marines!
Get off your butt before your butts blown off!
Don't die for oil, don't be a sucker."

[bat19]

^whatever the hell that means, its pretty gay.

Afghanistan. That was the original target. We then decided to attack Saddham over the dreaded "WMD's." Uh oh people. The fact is that we're there, doesn't matter why, the only thing that matters now is how long. The country is split down the middle on the topic of War. Liberals hate war and protest, Conservatives love war and support. It all boils down to what's best for the economy, because in our modern times that is really all that matters. Our involvement in WWII took us out of our greatest depression, our involvement in this war just might bring us back into one. War used to be a money making machine, but no longer since the advent of computers and factories run by machines. When computers build war technology faster and more efficiently than humans, there is no profit for our country. Where is the profit of War now?

In the oil.

I'll be the first to admit I hate that we are at war, especially in a country that we shouldn't have been in in the first place. However, to remain a "superpower" and our dominating status as the greatest country in the world we need to control the resource in highest demand. So what is best? What is best in the long run?

Economists want what is best for the country.
Libertarians want what is best for the world.

It is impossible to choose the most beneficial choice because what benefits one group does not benefit another. It is the problem, the first problem, as old as existence. There are two sides to every problem, two sides to every debate. There is never a problem with one specific solution(unless you count mathematics, but we're not, we're talking ethics) that everyone can agree upon. Moral problems come down to majority decision, economical problems come down to what creates the highest capital.

Basically, we don't want to be in Iraq, but we need to be there. We need to keep our standard of living in this country, our multi-million dollar movies, our billions of dollars a year spent on bottled water when countries in Africa don't even have running water. We need our Hot Pockets and our Next Top Model shows, and this will be our eventual downfall.

A solitary killer, the firetruck stalks it's prey. The firetruck can consume eight times it's bodt weight. (horn blares) The ambulances will have to wait their turn.

[demolished]

americans are lazy.

we bitch bitch bitch and we dont do a jack thing about it.

you think buying a sticker helps? ehhh.

[LovableGullible]

I do think that you can support the troops, but not support the "mission". They're two different things and you shouldn't let the line blur. Don't say that you are supporting the troops by not supporting what they're doing.

you can support the troops and not support the mission because it's not their fault they're out there. Yeah they signed the dotted line when they said they'll join the military but most of them never thought they would be fighting a war. Most of those soldiers oppose of the war in Iraq. I THINK to tend the people that say they can't support troops while you oppose of the mission is that they don't have any service relatives/friends that have been to Iraq and experienced them not coming back.

[Shahin]

I truly doubt that any of the servicemen or women in Iraq "want" to be there.

[*Steven*]

americans are lazy.

we bitch bitch bitch and we dont do a jack thing about it.

you think buying a sticker helps? ehhh.

But buying a sticker makes people feel better about themselves, and that's all that they care about.

you can support the troops and not support the mission because it's not their fault they're out there. Yeah they signed the dotted line when they said they'll join the military but most of them never thought they would be fighting a war. Most of those soldiers oppose of the war in Iraq. I THINK to tend the people that say they can't support troops while you oppose of the mission is that they don't have any service relatives/friends that have been to Iraq and experienced them not coming back.

Wow that was a tough one to read. Okay, we've been over the whole you don't support the mission then the troops get demoralized because they feel they're fighting something that the country doesn't want or care about, making it seem kinda pointless to be there in the first pace. Anywho, even if they signed the dotted line thinking they wouldn't be in a war, they should have anticipated conflict if they were at least watching the news and had a vague clue of what was going on in the world.

I truly doubt that any of the servicemen or women in Iraq "want" to be there.

That's nice and all, but I don't really think that's under debate.

[NoSex]

f**k the troops and the mission.
I don't know why I should respect someone who signs off to kill strangers for a paycheck.
Sounds like shit to me.
If only they knew.

P.S. All your arguments suck. What "Supporting the Troops" is is really relative to the desires and wishes of the troops. If the troops want to stay, supporting them would be letting them stay. If they want to leave, supporting them would be helping them leave. It's not that hard to figure, you f**k heads.

[*Steven*]

^f**k you too then. The troops don't sign up to go shoot people. They have to do what they're told. They sign up to defend the country, and in my opinion there's nothing more honorable than that. Without the troops and the army/navy/marines/airforce, we wouldn't be where we are right now. All the wars in the past (OMG WORLD WARS!!!) could have taken a different turn and we could very well be speaking german right now. If you knew the least bit about history and involvement with the military, you would understand the importance of having a military that's capable, at all times.

Also by supporting their want to leave, that supports insubordination in the military, and a military who doesn't listen to their commanders and does whatever they want isn't a very organized military. A non-organized military can be easily, very easily, beaten.

[NoSex]

^f**k you too then. The troops don't sign up to go shoot people. They have to do what they're told. They sign up to defend the country, and in my opinion there's nothing more honorable than that. Without the troops and the army/navy/marines/airforce, we wouldn't be where we are right now. All the wars in the past (OMG WORLD WARS!!!) could have taken a different turn and we could very well be speaking german right now. If you knew the least bit about history and involvement with the military, you would understand the importance of having a military that's capable, at all times.

Yeah, compare the "War in Iraq" to the World Wars.
You're an idiot. I don't respect people who do things merely because they're told to. Further, I don't buy into the idea that a lot of troops sign up for the sole purpose of protecting our country - I'm sure a few do, but I wouldn't imagine it being a very significant number. And, really, being involved in military action doesn't always mean that said action is in place to protect our country. The mere reality of fighting doesn't mean it has a justified or necessitated point. In the case of Iraq, I would argue that we are definitely fighting, but it isn't a fight designed to protect the American people. Worst of all, I would argue it is making us less safe. So, there is no real defense of the country involved in the Iraq war. None whatsoever.

I support some wars, and I do not support others. I support certain military actions, while I do not support the rest. You seem to be arguing that we should accept all military action, merely because it is military action. This, to me, is not a very convincing argument. We have to look at the context and content of the war - the reasoning behind it, the intended goals. And, then, we have to compare these justifications and goals to the fabric of reality. Here, I'm going to say one word, and you should understand: Vietnam.

Also by supporting their want to leave, that supports insubordination in the military, and a military who doesn't listen to their commanders and does whatever they want isn't a very organized military. A non-organized military can be easily, very easily, beaten.

Uhmm, it's called "Supporting the Troops" for a reason, jackass.
If you want to call it "Supporting a Strong Military", then go for it. But, they're not the same thing.

[faydedprimadonna]

ok... i agree with the point that you can't support the military's actions just because they are military actions... there are some things worth fighting for, but i really think that this war is not about what we were told it was about... i am by no means a liberal, but i really think that this war is about oil and a sad attempt to up the economy... it worked in the past, bush thought it would do it again... he was wrong... big surprise...

i also agree that there are most likely very few soldiers who sign up solely for the protection of the country... most of the soldiers that i know signed up for the paycheck and the improvement of their job status...

and i have to second the one word: vietnam... that one word speaks volumes... to me at least

[bat19]

You're an idiot. I don't respect people who do things merely because they're told to.

Call him an idiot but I'll call you retarded because thats the most retarded thing Ive ever heard. Joining the military is a job, just like any other. People for the most part join the military for some guidance with their lives because they are unsure of what to do for a living. Which is fine, and the military is definitely a respectful path. But like every job they have to do what their told or they'll get fired, or worse. In the case of the military they will get arrested. So no, they may not want to shoot people, but thats what we as taxpayers paid for them to train to do and thats what they signed up for when they took the job in the first place.

Im guessing you're about 13 with your hand on your cock looking at nudie pics while you type half the bullshit you spew out. When you get a little older, you'll realize that when you have a job with a boss, you either do what he tells you or say goodbye to that job.

[NoSex]

When you get a little older, you'll realize that when you have a job with a boss, you either do what he tells you or say goodbye to that job.

When it comes down to shooting at strangers and being shot at by strangers for the insurance of fat cat bank accounts, you're a sick, immoral, weak, and scared fool if you don't leave. What kind of people are you talking about? The kind that get their kicks by blowing up innocent people from the safety and distance of the sea? f**k them. Stand up for what you think is right. Say "no" to the military.

Your miserable attempt at an analogy fails. Of course, cause you're an idiot. What should I expect from a "Ra ra, I love war" moron like yourself?
I wash dishes. I do it for money. It isn't that offensive.
Killing people for oil, not so inoffensive. Moron.

Wage earners everywhere, rejoice! You can get paid to kill!
Stop! Put down that dish! Pick up a gun! Get your legs blown off!

[*Steven*]

When it comes down to shooting at strangers and being shot at by strangers for the insurance of fat cat bank accounts, you're a sick, immoral, weak, and scared fool if you don't leave. What kind of people are you talking about? The kind that get their kicks by blowing up innocent people from the safety and distance of the sea?

People who have the balls and honor to complete what they signed up for and not run away like cowards.

This reminds me of a bumper sticker I saw the other day that made me chuckle:
Excluding nazism, fascism, communism, and slavery, war has never solved anything.

You can come back with a retort saying it's dumb to not be the coward and f**k honor it doesn't mean a damn thing if you're dead, but I'd rather be dead and remembered as a hero than known all my life as a coward who fled combat while my friends were being shot at.

[*Uronacid*]

When it comes down to shooting at strangers and being shot at by strangers for the insurance of fat cat bank accounts, you're a sick, immoral, weak, and scared fool if you don't leave. What kind of people are you talking about? The kind that get their kicks by blowing up innocent people from the safety and distance of the sea? f**k them. Stand up for what you think is right. Say "no" to the military.

Your miserable attempt at an analogy fails. Of course, cause you're an idiot. What should I expect from a "Ra ra, I love war" moron like yourself?
I wash dishes. I do it for money. It isn't that offensive.
Killing people for oil, not so inoffensive. Moron.

Wage earners everywhere, rejoice! You can get paid to kill!
Stop! Put down that dish! Pick up a gun! Get your legs blown off!

Omg, get out of America. Go move to another country. Jeremy is so completely correct. War is about money. Life is about competition to survive in every aspect. We aren't killing people who aren't shooting at us or others, and please don't give me some horror story about how a very tiny (less than 0.01%) minority of soldiers went crazy and killed some-one for no reason. We're killing terrorists and people who are shooting at us. It's not like were just going into another country running and gunning innocent people.

Nate, oil is definitely one of our goals (it's just not politically correct), but it's not the only one. Since when have we been blowing up innocent people from a "safe" distance. Our soldiers are being shot at, and we are stationed within Iraq itself. You're just throwing out a bunch of falsified information.

You sound like another tool that heard something from someone they know that was really upsetting. LMAO, YOU ARE WASHING DISHES YOU LEMMING.

Also Nate, how can you accuse Jeremy of being immoral. You're an atheist. There is no moral standard for atheism. In atheism, morals are relative to the individual. You're morals are set by a combination of the society you live in and the way it effects you. Seeing as it's impossible for someone to have the life as you, no-one has the same morals as you. No-one gives a fuck about what you deem is immoral or moral because it doesn't matter. Why should we care. It's not like you're part of a religion that sets a moral standard for you interpret or debate.

On a side note:
LMAO, you're just a loose pussy Nate (someone who has been f**ked up by pacifistic bullshit to the point of no return). When this country goes to war on it's homeland you're going to get a bullet in your ass, and I'll put a bullet in your head to ease the pain. I don't want a coward on my side that's not willing to do what's necessary to survive. Pacifism is nothing but an idea that will never happen. It's a dream and nothing more. Keep washing dishes and listening to "John Mayer". You can be one of those morons "Waiting on the World to Change". Aren't you 19 years old... OMG get a new job... looser. xD

People who have the balls and honor to complete what they signed up for and not run away like cowards.

This reminds me of a bumper sticker I saw the other day that made me chuckle:
Excluding nazism, fascism, communism, and slavery, war has never solved anything.

You can come back with a retort saying it's dumb to not be the coward and f**k honor it doesn't mean a damn thing if you're dead, but I'd rather be dead and remembered as a hero than known all my life as a coward who fled combat while my friends were being shot at.

AMERICA FUCK YEAH!!!

[NoSex]

Omg, get out of America. Go move to another country. Jeremy is so completely correct. War is about money. Life is about competition to survive in every aspect. We aren't killing people who aren't shooting at us or others, and please don't give me some horror story about how a very tiny (less than 0.01%) minority of soldiers went crazy and killed some-one for no reason. We're killing terrorists and people who are shooting at us. It's not like were just going into another country running and gunning innocent people.

Nate, oil is definitely one of our goals (it's just not politically correct), but it's not the only one. Since when have we been blowing up innocent people from a "safe" distance. Our soldiers are being shot at, and we are stationed within Iraq itself. You're just throwing out a bunch of falsified information.

You sound like another tool that heard something from someone they know that was really upsetting. LMAO, YOU ARE WASHING DISHES YOU LEMMING.

Also Nate, how can you accuse Jeremy of being immoral. You're an atheist. There is no moral standard for atheism. In atheism, morals are relative to the individual. You're morals are set by a combination of the society you live in and the way it effects you. Seeing as it's impossible for someone to have the life as you, no-one has the same morals as you. No-one gives a fuck about what you deem is immoral or moral because it doesn't matter. Why should we care. It's not like you're part of a religion that sets a moral standard for you interpret or debate.

On a side note:
LMAO, you're just a loose pussy Nate (someone who has been f**ked up by pacifistic bullshit to the point of no return). When this country goes to war on it's homeland you're going to get a bullet in your ass, and I'll put a bullet in your head to ease the pain. I don't want a coward on my side that's not willing to do what's necessary to survive. Pacifism is nothing but an idea that will never happen. It's a dream and nothing more. Keep washing dishes and listening to "John Mayer". You can be one of those morons "Waiting on the World to Change". Aren't you 19 years old... OMG get a new job... looser. xD
AMERICA FUCK YEAH!!!

I'll get back to your dumb ass in a while, I just got back from Bloomington. This recycled bullshit is too boring to comment on when I'm this tired.

[*Steven*]

I'll get back to your dumb ass in a while, I just got back from Bloomington. This recycled bullshit is too boring to comment on when I'm this tired.

I'd like to see what part of your arguments aren't recycled.

[*Uronacid*]

I'll get back to your dumb ass in a while, I just got back from Bloomington. This recycled bullshit is too boring to comment on when I'm this tired.

Wash those recycled dishes Nate. Don't come back til' you're a man.

[NoSex]

I'd like to see what part of your arguments aren't recycled.

The parts that haven't been repeated over and over again in this thread ad nauseum.
That's all I meant.

Wash those recycled dishes Nate. Don't come back til' you're a man.

Masculinity isn't cool.

[bat19]

I'll get back to your dumb ass in a while, I just got back from Bloomington. This recycled bullshit is too boring to comment on when I'm this tired.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

You f**kin pussy. You got told, just admit it. You realized that what you said was retarded and now can't defend it anymore without sounding even more gay.
P.S. I was never for the war, not even in those few weeks after 9/11 when everyone went revenge crazy and wanted to just smoke motherf**kers. But the difference between you and me Nate is that I understand the need for war and you have filled your head with so much anti-establishment bullshit that you can't recognize anything anymore. Do I want the troops home? Absolutely. But I understand they have a job to do. So while they do theirs, you do yours. scrub scrub scrub

[*Uronacid*]

The parts that haven't been repeated over and over again in this thread ad nauseum.
That's all I meant.
Masculinity isn't cool.

Then have yourself neutered. I don't like the idea of your future children effecting society.

[*Steven*]

Hey hey now. As much as one might want to bash, let's refrain in here for the sake of debate. Thanks :)

[NoSex]

Hey hey now. As much as one might want to bash, let's refrain in here for the sake of debate. Thanks :)

You suck.

[Kontroll]

Alright, after looking at a bunch of your comments, I see that every one is ignorant of the mentality of soldiers. Some people say they don't want to be over there and some say they do. Sure, there are those that don't and those that do, but like Steven said...they should anticipate that we could go to war or conflict at anytime. It comes with the territory.

Soldiers are trained to kill. It's their job. We've all got that established. Their taught how to take down the enemy during any situation. It's kill or be killed. There's no room for guilt or a conscience during time of battle. In our society, it's not in the norm for some one to just go kill another person, unless they are a murderer. But, we're talking about a normal US citizen. How is it that you've got those US citizens able to kill with ease, without question, now that they have become soldiers?

Like I said, you really can't just a situation with out knowing all the details. How are you going to judge a person if you don't understand their logic?

Oh, and NoSex...you know what? It's those people that are trained to kill strangers that allow you to bash them. Without a standing army, our country would go to ruins. We live in a world where security is a prime issue, and we need an army to survive.

Also, this is annoying me alot. We are not over in the Middle East for oil. We don't even get most of our oil from over there. We get it from Canada and Central America. I don't know why everyone is under the impression that we only get oil from over there.

[lljay06]

Alright, after looking at a bunch of your comments, I see that every one is ignorant of the mentality of soldiers......

I didnt read the rest of the debate but i do have a bit of an opinion on the topic since my best friends are in the military, I am in the military and we were all raised in the military setting. The military is why we are all still living, I was unaware of this at a younger age and one day made a comment to my parents "I hate the navy" my mother said if it weren't for the navy I wouldn't be around....which made me think. If we didnt have a standing military of some sort we would be in ruins. off that topic and onto the war I have a good friend and he is infantry in the marines...you know why he does that job? he likes to blow things up seriously! thats why most guy do go that route. They like to see fire that they made; hell I would love that feeling too. But when he comes back he will be a whole different person and he already knows that. I am probably off topic and thats because i have one too many opinions on the topic. I love the military and I love my country too. what we I hate is the politics thats are invovled...and the reason they can shoot people they dont know is because guess what they would die if they didnt not only they also take themselves out of the situation so they can do it....


I probably more to say but i'm stopping here....

[NoSex]

Oh, and NoSex...you know what? It's those people that are trained to kill strangers that allow you to bash them. Without a standing army, our country would go to ruins. We live in a world where security is a prime issue, and we need an army to survive.

The "War in Iraq" has nothing to do with security, freedom, or survival.
Are you people dense?

[Kontroll]

The "War in Iraq" has nothing to do with security, freedom, or survival.
Are you people dense?

It actually has a lot to do with those. We got rid of a dictator, and now trying to establish a free government. We are there for security and the survival of the country.

[NoSex]

It actually has a lot to do with those. We got rid of a dictator, and now trying to establish a free government. We are there for security and the survival of the country.

Might as well invade every oppressed and or repressed third world country, huh?
Wanna police the globe? Rock and roll?

[lilsnoopy]

The worse thing a citizen can do is bash their own country, blame their country for its problems (when they can vote on issues, which most ppl dont do anymore), and demoralize their military

I strongly beleive that when a country's own citizens start saying how we shouldnt be in the middle east, how the battles should'nt be fought since it's not going to do anything in the future, and that their is no purpose for being there, that tehy are demoralizing the troops.

What military person wouldnt feel demoralized when their own country see's no purpose for their death? That their is no reason to be there even though they are scarificing a year or more from their home, family, and loved ones?

[lilsnoopy]

Might as well invade every oppressed and or repressed third world country, huh?
Wanna police the globe? Rock and roll?

Any third world country who attacks America.
Im glad to see that America actually took a stand against a dictator who probably would have gone even further if we didnt do anything in the beginning.
That is what happened with Hitler after he began attacking surronding European countries....no one did anything, and he killed thousands of people and began a war. Nobody tried to take a stand in his earlier actions and the world payed a heavy price.

[*Uronacid*]

Any third world country who attacks America.
Im glad to see that America actually took a stand against a dictator who probably would have gone even further if we didnt do anything in the beginning.
That is what happened with Hitler after he began attacking surronding European countries....no one did anything, and he killed thousands of people and began a war. Nobody tried to take a stand in his earlier actions and the world payed a heavy price.

They didn't attack us, yet...

[*Steven*]

They didn't attack us, yet...

Unless you want to link things by several degrees of separation.


Okay, so I was seeing the other day that there was news of the US troops leaving Iraq. Too bad everone's going to think it's because people came to their right mind and are getting the hell out of that shit hole. What they'll fail to realize is that they're leaving because what they've been doing is working. The Iraqis have amassed an army of, I think, 125 thousand troops. The troops are going to leave incrimentaly if it looks like the Iraqi army has things under wrap.

[bat19]

True Jake, we don't get most of our oil from Iraq, but we will soon enough. Think about this for a second. Imagine a world where gas costs $.85 a gallon, to fill your tank would cost only about $10-15. Imagine a world without those goddamn hibrid cars. Also imagine if you will a country who's militarial morale is boosted from having a victory for once. Our last real victory was in WW2 and we had to drop nuclear bombs to do it. America is no longer the superpower it once was with the greatest military in the world. Sure, we may have the best weapons, but what does that amount to when faced against people who would gladly die for their beliefs and their country.
The golden age of America came right after WW2 when many people were happiest. Then came Vietnam which destroyed our belief in our country as this immaculate perfection of all that can and should be in a country. So while we may be there now trying to set up Democracy, we will stay there for the main purpose of the oil to try and bring back some remnant memory of a country that people supported and were happy to come from.

[lljay06]

Do you really think they are going to bring the troops home by december?
Not going to happen...
I got a letter from my friend Iraq and he said when they heard that was being said they laughed.....
I know from experience when the "higher ups" say something don't believe it until it actually happens.



and the oil thing nice try but it will never happen. You have to factor human emotion.

[*Steven*]

Do you really think they are going to bring the troops home by december?
Not going to happen...
I got a letter from my friend Iraq and he said when they heard that was being said they laughed.....
I know from experience when the "higher ups" say something don't believe it until it actually happens.
and the oil thing nice try but it will never happen. You have to factor human emotion.

Who mentioned december?

[lljay06]

It's what is going around, like I said I have friends there and I am also in the military.

[*Steven*]

If I may ask, what branch of the military? What's your mos? Rank? Stationed where?

Anyways, according to this CNN thing, it's august 08.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/03/08/dem...iraq/index.html
I know CNN is a load of crap, but if someone's going to have a rumor of when the troops will be pulled out, it will be CNN.

[lljay06]

if you must know intel, e-4 and I guess if we all relied on CNN we'ld know it all too

[lilsnoopy]

Sure, we may have the best weapons, but what does that amount to when faced against people who would gladly die for their beliefs and their country.

We do have the best weapons
I think that amunts to a lot. After all, I'd feel really secure if I knew that our country had better weapons than the enemy.
common sense

More importantly however, is your pissimistic comment. At my college, all the marines that are their are proud of their country. In fact, they fought in the middle east.
Are you assuming that our soldiers have no passion for their country? If so, you have absolutly no right to make such a comment, since from viewing your earlier posts in this thread and others all I can see is an individual who has no passion or hope for America.
if not, well, I agree with your comment to a certain extent. In <b>modern wars</b> as in from the cold war forward, hope and passion for a country does not save you.

[bat19]

^ Well, lets see. We have the best weapons, true. But we suck at guerilla warfare. We're horrible actually. High grade weapons dont amount to shit when we've got kids planting road side bombs and women hiding mortars under their berkas. You should feel safe that we have the best weapons. That means that we are very well defended at home, in this country. So we really have nothing to worry about as far as another country invading us. But when we invade other countries, we lose obviously the home field advantage and we lose the divide of enemy and civilian. We cannot open fire in a crowded street because we would kill innocent people. Our extremist enemies seem to have no problem suicide bombing public places though. We have all these nuclear weapons and WMDs, but what do they mean if we can never f**kin use them? They mean absolutely nothing. Their our insurance at home. This country spent so much time and money on insuring a country that was already militarily safe would be even more safe than they did training our soldiers in new ways of combat. Weapons will not win this war, strategy and proper training will.

[*Uronacid*]

^ Well, lets see. We have the best weapons, true. But we suck at guerilla warfare. We're horrible actually. High grade weapons dont amount to shit when we've got kids planting road side bombs and women hiding mortars under their berkas. You should feel safe that we have the best weapons. That means that we are very well defended at home, in this country. So we really have nothing to worry about as far as another country invading us. But when we invade other countries, we lose obviously the home field advantage and we lose the divide of enemy and civilian. We cannot open fire in a crowded street because we would kill innocent people. Our extremist enemies seem to have no problem suicide bombing public places though. We have all these nuclear weapons and WMDs, but what do they mean if we can never fucking use them? They mean absolutely nothing. Their our insurance at home. This country spent so much time and money on insuring a country that was already militarily safe would be even more safe than they did training our soldiers in new ways of combat. Weapons will not win this war, strategy and proper training will.

i will agree when you say that we are at a disadvantage when it comes to fighting in another country. We have all these fucking rules we have to follow. People put so much value on human life. Even on the lives of people who probably don't even deserve to live. It ridiculous.

Like those naked Iraqi dudes that were stacked on top of each other a couple years ago. People were "up in arms" over that shit. Truth is, if those guys weren't tied up in that prison, if those guys weren't being stacked on top of each other, if those guys weren't wearing cloths then they probably would have been wearing bombs and killing civilians anyways.

I hate fucking pacifists and idealists. All they have a fucking dreams that can never exist. When will they learn that the world will never be a perfect place. People are selfish, and if you give them an inch they'll take a mile. Wake the fuck up people, there are times when war is needed. Freedom isn't free, it never was. There are times when people have to die.

People are so fucking touchy about the dumbest shit.

[*Steven*]

if you must know intel, e-4 and I guess if we all relied on CNN we'ld know it all too

Where are you stationed? What's your MOS? What branch?

[Kontroll]

They didn't attack us, yet...

They were advocates though.

And to Josh and Jeremy. No crap we're at a disadvantage when it come to fighting in another country. Especially when everyone pretty much blends together and we don't know who the enemy is.

Also, to Jeremy and Josh. We have the best military. Who else competes? I mean, the only country that I can think of is England, and they are on our side. Where do you think the Taliban got their training from? America. So, in reality, we know what they are going to do.

Our tactics and stragedies are so much more sophisticated than theirs. Man power really doesn't mean anything anymore. Just security. Most of the soldiers over in the Middle East don't even see combat. Most of the ones who do are usually Special Forces. They are the first ones it to make sure everything is clear and safe to enter.

Take a little pride in your country, damnit.

[NoSex]

Any third world country who attacks America.
Im glad to see that America actually took a stand against a dictator who probably would have gone even further if we didnt do anything in the beginning.
That is what happened with Hitler after he began attacking surronding European countries....no one did anything, and he killed thousands of people and began a war. Nobody tried to take a stand in his earlier actions and the world payed a heavy price.

You're comparing Hitler to Saddam Hussein.
You're comparing the German Army to... what exactly?
You f**king idiot.

[*Uronacid*]

You're comparing Hitler to Saddam Hussein.
You're comparing the German Army to... what exactly?
You f**king idiot.

So, what you're saying is that his opinion doesn't matter because he's an idiot? Point well taken.

[Shahin]

You're comparing Hitler to Saddam Hussein.
You're comparing the German Army to... what exactly?
You f**king idiot.

You're a douchebag of epic proportions. While comparing Hussein to Hitler is a bit of a stretch, in smaller terms the comparison isn't idiotic. Saddam Hussein gassed his own people, because he didn't like them.

Don't call people "f**king idiots" when you have no point to make yourself.

[*Steven*]

Stop throwing around insults and bashing.

[bat19]

^Douche

You're comparing Hitler to Saddam Hussein.
You're comparing the German Army to... what exactly?
You f**king idiot.

^Douchebag

[*Steven*]

The-Abominable-CPillar, this is your verbal warning for member bashing. You will receive a PM.

[NoSex]

Don't call people "f**king idiots" when you have no point to make yourself.

My point is Saddam Hussein was never a threat to national security or an ingredient of world war. He simply was not threatening enough to mandate a war. My point is that it is a false analogy, while the world wars may have been justified, I don't believe that the conflict in Iraq is. So, why should we be there? And, if the war isn't about our defense and safety, why should we support it and why shouldn't we want our troops home and actually safe?

[lilsnoopy]

Any third world country who attacks America.
Im glad to see that America actually took a stand against a dictator who probably would have gone even further if we didnt do anything in the beginning.
That is what happened with Hitler after he began attacking surronding European countries....no one did anything, and he killed thousands of people and began a war. Nobody tried to take a stand in his earlier actions and the world payed a heavy price.

You're comparing Hitler to Saddam Hussein.
You're comparing the German Army to... what exactly?
You f**king idiot.

First off Im not an idiot. Really, Im not. If anyone is an idiot, its someone who cant even try to understand what Im saying, and then feels the need to bash me on the internet. Its not very nice. Be more understanding to other people's beleifs (sp?), you'll need that skill in the real world.
Anyways, moving on. I wasnt comparing those two people. I was referring to how people reacted to two differnet scernios.
Hitler's form of foriegn policy was taking over European countires, starting with poland. The Allies allowed him to do this, since if they didnt, they might start another war (which they didnt want to do).
Yet, since the Allies didnt stop Hitler in the begining, after he took over Poland, they allowed WW2 to start, which resulted in thousands of people dying.
After the two towers were destroyed, America actually fought back. Imagine if America didnt fight back? If we didnt, America might have gotten attacked again, in a more devasting way. Terrorist's dont follow modern way of fighting, so anything that resembles the word "crazy" is possible for them.
All Im saying is that America got rid of a tyrant who attempt'd to install fear in countries by terrorist methods by hitting the US first. If we didnt get rid of him, who would? We got rid of a potential threat, unlike the Allies in WW2

[bat19]

The-Abominable-CPillar, this is your verbal warning for member bashing. You will receive a PM.

^Double-Douche

[NoSex]

After the two towers were destroyed, America actually fought back. Imagine if America didnt fight back? If we didnt, America might have gotten attacked again, in a more devasting way. Terrorist's dont follow modern way of fighting, so anything that resembles the word "crazy" is possible for them.
All Im saying is that America got rid of a tyrant who attempt'd to install fear in countries by terrorist methods by hitting the US first.

What would prevent terrorists from attacking us again?
It's like trying to eliminate school shootings. You can't do it.
Correlation doesn't mean causation. Just because we weren't attacked again doesn't mean that our offensive position is actually preventing terrorist attacks. Remember, this isn't the first time the US has been attacked by terrorists (Hell, it isn't even the first time the WTC was attacked) , and it won't be the last (Well, for those towers it will be). Anyone can instill fear, not everyone can actually launch a serious invasion. Figure it out.

Oh, and don't forget: there is no connection between Saddam Hussein and the September 11th terrorist attacks. Moron.

[*Steven*]

^Double-Douche

This is your warning. You'll receive a PM momentarily.

[bat19]

This is your warning. You'll receive a PM momentarily.

^triple-douche

Josh (Uronacid) and I are in agreement that you're acting like a little pansy bitch on a powertrip and are completely retarded for thinking that I care if you raise my warning level. I was at 40% when you raised it, you think that might have been a sign. Dumbass

[*Michelle*]

^triple-douche

Josh (Uronacid) and I are in agreement that you're acting like a little pansy bitch on a powertrip and are completely retarded for thinking that I care if you raise my warning level. I was at 40% when you raised it, you think that might have been a sign. Dumbass

Really? Because just a few days ago, Josh PM'd me saying something along the lines of "YOU AND YOUR BOYFRIEND RULE". I don't really remember b/c I deleted it. It seems like we've got way too many hypocritical two-faced bitches on cB, then.

[*Steven*]

Josh (Uronacid) and I are in agreement that you're acting like a little pansy bitch on a powertrip and are completely retarded for thinking that I care if you raise my warning level. I was at 40% when you raised it, you think that might have been a sign. Dumbass

That's fine and dandy, but if you have something to say about me let's go to mod performance and we can argue the issue there.

[bat19]

Crazy Michelle, in rebuttal to your statement, Josh did in fact say that he thought Steven was cool because of the three of us completely destroying Nate in that argument we had a few posts back. But then as all people young and drunk with power, he turned into a DOUCHE.

And Steven, I dont give a shit if its PM or posts, its a nonsensical argument that "Douche" is really worth having such a long stick up your ass. Did you lube it well before jamming it up there or did you go the painful way? Whatever you do, stay away from Bran. It has lots of Fiber and let me tell you, it will hurt soooo bad.

[*Michelle*]

Crazy Michelle, in rebuttal to your statement, Josh did in fact say that he thought Steven was cool because of the three of us completely destroying Nate in that argument we had a few posts back. But then as all people young and drunk with power, he turned into a DOUCHE.

O RLY? I was under the impression that it had nothing to do with Nate (whoever he is) b/c I have no idea what the f**k you're talking about. If Josh wants to prance around and suck dick to people he thinks are "cool" that's fine with me, but please tell him to be somewhat consistent in the people who he has "new respect for" b/c it makes him look like a somewhat more successful troll than he(or you) is.

[bat19]

O RLY? I was under the impression that it had nothing to do with Nate (whoever he is) b/c I have no idea what the f**k you're talking about. If Josh wants to prance around and suck dick to people he thinks are "cool" that's fine with me, but please tell him to be somewhat consistent in the people who he has "new respect for" b/c it makes him look like a somewhat more successful troll than he(or you) is.

first off, you better watch your tone honey-tits. Thats my friend you're talking about with that mouth. If he wants to suck some dick, thats his perogative, you go back to your buisness of doing the same.

Secondly, I have no idea what you meant with that last sentence. Are you suggesting we're ugly or something? It made no sense. Learn sentence structure.

[*Michelle*]

first off, you better watch your tone honey-tits. Thats my friend you're talking about with that mouth. If he wants to suck some dick, thats his perogative, you go back to your buisness of doing the same.

Secondly, I have no idea what you meant with that last sentence. Are you suggesting we're ugly or something? It made no sense. Learn sentence structure.

I realize he is your friend, and I could care less whose dicks he wants to suck. I am merely suggesting that he should be more consistent in who he wants to suck, because it makes him look less intelligent when he bounces his head around from different types of dicks.

My sentence seems perfectly clear to me, so learn communication.

[bat19]

Actually honey-tits, I had to learn nerd speak. What got me was that you were calling us trolls. I dont know what the f**k a troll is, well I didnt. I do now, had to call up Josh and find out. He says that if you really want to suck his dick that bad, you'll have to take a number. There's a long line of people and I dont think there are any cuts.

[lilsnoopy]

What would prevent terrorists from attacking us again?
It's like trying to eliminate school shootings. You can't do it.
Correlation doesn't mean causation. Just because we weren't attacked again doesn't mean that our offensive position is actually preventing terrorist attacks. Remember, this isn't the first time the US has been attacked by terrorists (Hell, it isn't even the first time the WTC was attacked) , and it won't be the last (Well, for those towers it will be). Anyone can instill fear, not everyone can actually launch a serious invasion. Figure it out.

Oh, and don't forget: there is no connection between Saddam Hussein and the September 11th terrorist attacks. Moron.

Again, Im not COMPARING those two figures
-_-"
Im COMPARING how people reacted to the issue
I stated that already.
obviously you can read, but you lack the ability to put two and two together when you dont agree with something. Its like you shut off what the person is saying just because you dont like the first part of the sentence.

[NoSex]

Im COMPARING how people reacted to the issue

Your point being?

[bat19]

^hahaha. Nosex, very accurate. The name I mean, not whatever you posted, cause based on your opinions in the past, how they're always dead wrong and simply retarded, you're wrong in this matter as well.

[NoSex]

^hahaha. Nosex, very accurate. The name I mean, not whatever you posted, cause based on your opinions in the past, how they're always dead wrong and simply retarded, you're wrong in this matter as well.

I'm so offended.

[lilsnoopy]

Your point being?

That is the point
-_-"

Its not very hard to understand, my 13 year old cousin understood it, so you should be able to!

[NoSex]

That is the point
-_-"

Its not very hard to understand, my 13 year old cousin understood it, so you should be able to!

Im glad to see that America actually took a stand against a dictator who probably would have gone even further if we didnt do anything in the beginning.
That is what happened with Hitler after he began attacking surronding European countries....no one did anything, and he killed thousands of people and began a war. Nobody tried to take a stand in his earlier actions and the world payed a heavy price.

So, your point is that if we didn't invade Iraq, Saddam Hussein was going to pull a Hitler and start attacking neighboring countries and throw us into world war?

I thought my replies already covered this foolishness.
If they didn't, then what is your point?