Abortion Options

[*CrackedRearView*]

there are too many pro-choice people in america for this nation to ban/strictly limit abortion. so.. yeah.

okay, i'd like to say that i'm pro-life, but you really have to consider the issue from the pregnant woman's perspective. i can only imagine how ruined my life would be if i got pregnant in college with my entire future ahead of me. if i were ever placed in that situation (not that i will ever be), i really can't say for sure that i would keep the baby.

This is where the "one and you're done" circumstantial law comes into play.

I can stomach one abortion, or even two, but not 10 (and women with 10 abortions on record do exist).

[xlauren73x]

i've worked up a whole argument for this, so don't even try to argue with me. im totally against abortion.

1) People say women should have a choice, well sorry but unless you were raped you had a choice when you had sex. I know that sounds harsh, but you have to pay for your actions.

2) If I went out and shot someone and killed them, fully knowing what I did and plenty of people saw and i confessed and what not.. no question that i did it, i would be convicted of murder. This isnt accepted in society right? Okay now if my mother went and shot my sister in the head and killed her, same circumstances as above, she would be convicted of murder. This is not accepted in society either. So why is it okay for a mother to kill her unborn child? THAT IS MURDER.

3. Don't even say the baby isn't alive yet. Scientists have had things saying what a living thing does for years.. eats, breaths, reacts to environment, etc etc. A baby inside a mothers womb does all this. Also, what would you say if i asked you what a miscarriage is? When a baby DIES in a mothers womb or during delivery. How can a living thing die? its NOT POSSIBLE. Therefore, the baby is alive, so now refer up to #2.

4) I understand that its hard, and i know i cannot totally understand because i'm not in the situation, but murder is murder. Killing a life can not be excused for any reason.. there are so many people out there who want children and cannot have them, if you cannot support a child plenty of those people can.

lol sry to be so straightforward, it sounds better when im in person but thats my argument for it.

[JlIaTMK]

yes- but religion has been the source of much conflict.  if religion never existed, the world would be a better place for it.

  but...  minda is our savior.  minda is uncorruptable.  he is always right.

Lol, I'm not all too sure about that Justin....

Religion is actually what led the [world] this far, for good and for bad.
If we didn't have it.... I wouldn't like to say it, but the world would be barbaric and ravaging.

Most people need something to accompany them in life and to have as a higher form of life.

[Unpredictable]

ok im against abortion as well..
but consider this..
think of all the kids in foster homes..
think of how many get adopted..
not that many..
so what happens if no one adopts you??
what happens if you turn 18..
no where to go...
no education..
no family..
what then??

[sadolakced acid]

Lol, I'm not all too sure about that Justin....

Religion is actually what led the [world] this far, for good and for bad.
If we didn't have it.... I wouldn't like to say it, but the world would be barbaric and ravaging.

Most people need something to accompany them in life and to have as a higher form of life.

ehh... religion, constantly good or bad.

it motivates people, but sometimes to the wrong direction (aztecs, you know)

xlauren73x, please read the whole thread (ok, it's long, but at least like... the first few and last few pages...) those arguments have been used already.

[Paradox of Life]

i've worked up a whole argument for this, so don't even try to argue with me. im totally against abortion.

This is a debate forum, love. People will debate.

1) People say women should have a choice, well sorry but unless you were raped you had a choice when you had sex. I know that sounds harsh, but you have to pay for your actions.

You're not paying for your actions by putting another child through pain. If one can't take care of their own child, it's a mother's RIGHT to get an abortion.

"You cannot kill what you did not create" - Duality by Slipknot

But in the case of a mother and her unborn child, shouldn't the mother have a choice to destroy or keep what she created?

"Unless you were raped"

Regardless, a woman should have a right to do what she wants to do with her own child. Government should not be able to take "legal" control over a woman's child. How are you to make a law that says "Unless a woman is raped, they are not allowed to get an abortion" People would plead innocent by saying "No, but I was raped!"

2) If I went out and shot someone and killed them, fully knowing what I did and plenty of people saw and i confessed and what not.. no question that i did it, i would be convicted of murder. This isnt accepted in society right? Okay now if my mother went and shot my sister in the head and killed her, same circumstances as above, she would be convicted of murder. This is not accepted in society either. So why is it okay for a mother to kill her unborn child? THAT IS MURDER.

It's murder for the good of the child! If a mother is 14 years old and can't take care of a baby, it's only best for her child's welfare that she abort it. Otherwise, the child may live a life in an orphanage, get adopted by abusive parents and whatnot. When that all can be avoided by simply erasing the baby from existence before it can feel and before something horrible could happen.

3. Don't even say the baby isn't alive yet. Scientists have had things saying what a living thing does for years.. eats, breaths, reacts to environment, etc etc. A baby inside a mothers womb does all this. Also, what would you say if i asked you what a miscarriage is? When a baby DIES in a mothers womb or during delivery. How can a living thing die? its NOT POSSIBLE. Therefore, the baby is alive, so now refer up to #2.

Yeah, it's dead. Blah blah, big deal. As insensitive as I may sound, it's necessary for the debate. HELLO, IT'S THE MOTHER'S BABY. Does she not have a say in what happens to her own creation?

4) I understand that its hard, and i know i cannot totally understand because i'm not in the situation, but murder is murder. Killing a life can not be excused for any reason.. there are so many people out there who want children and cannot have them, if you cannot support a child plenty of those people can.

And then the child grows up and has to deal with unwanted drama because they find out they're adopted. And the world gets overpopulated with parentless children in poor orphanages because the mothers don't get to abort their poor babies. Lovely lovely world.

[innovation]

yes- but religion has been the source of much conflict.  if religion never existed, the world would be a better place for it.

  but...  minda is our savior.  minda is uncorruptable.  he is always right.

if love, passion, curiosity, anger, opinion, or any other human emotion never existed, the world would be a more peaceful place.

religion is just a natural part of this world; you can't expect everyone to believe the same thing. sure, there would be no war without controversy or difference in opinion. but life would be dull and pointless without anything to seek/explore.

oh man. how did this turn into another religion thread?

DERRINGTON.

[sadolakced acid]

if love, passion, curiosity, anger, opinion, or any other human emotion never existed, the world would be a more peaceful place.

religion is just a natural part of this world; you can't expect everyone to believe the same thing. sure, there would be no war without controversy or difference in opinion. but life would be dull and pointless without anything to seek/explore.

oh man. how did this turn into another religion thread?

DERRINGTON. 

because of the religious reasons for banning abortions....

[*Weird addiction*]

i've worked up a whole argument for this, so don't even try to argue with me. im totally against abortion.

Lmao......*shakes head*

My opinion:

I think abortion is wrong. You had unprotected sex, you got pregnant, then you want to abort the baby? is something wrong with you? you need to be locked up. That is YOUR baby, the consequence of what you did...if you feel you can't take care of it, give it up for adoption, there are thousands of couples who want babies...don't be selfish...

Lets say you got raped...terrible, i know. I understand if you consider abortion, not your fault but still...how can you do something like that? To me, it's murder...yes it is...give it up for adoption for christ sake... (...i don't really have much to say in this case, i think it's wrong but oh well)...

And for people who say "it's the mother's choice", WTF?? NOBODY has the right to take someone's life...to decide who lives and who doesn't. You have absolutely NO right to deprive a baby from living...It's not the mother's choice, neither is it the father's choice...for christ's sake...imagine this:

I gave birth to a baby...the child grows up and one day decides to steal...i find out and get SO mad and kill MY CHILD...hey don't be mad, it's my child, i have a right to do what i want with it, don't i? (stupid example, but it's the same thing as saying "it's the mother's choice".

If a 14 year old had unprotected sex and says "i can't take care of a baby, not right now, i'm unfit", you are 14, you are TOO young for sex, but that doesn't bother you, you give birth to a baby and that bothers you? what can i say... if you don't want to push the baby out, have a c section...or what not.

What i noticed, NONE of you knows what it feels like to be called a murderer, well i do... no i was never pregnant...but my friend Vanessa got pregnant early this year, she told me but she couldn't tell her mom. She made me promise not to tell. She aborted the baby but her mom found out (she's a nurse) and vanessa put the blame on me...her mom was like "you are as guilty as vanessa, you knew what she was going to do and you didn't tell me. You murderer" Yes she said that. She's hispanic, and she cursed me in spanish ... They moved Vanessa to Panama. Her mom doesn't talk to me, she thinks i'm a killer...Only 6 people know about this in Belgium: vanessa, her mom, her sisters (2), my bestfriend and I. Her family in Panama are giving her a tough time...

Gosh, my hands hurt

[*disco infiltrator*]

Sandra, you're bringing up points that have already been discussed.

We've already proven that fetuses in the first three weeks aren't living at all, whatsoever and embryos throughout first trimester aren't scientifically considered to be living, even though some people morally consider them living.

Therefore, aborting in the first trimester of pregnancy (when most abortions are done) isn't murder at all. For something to die, it has to be living first.

[*Weird addiction*]

^ I know you've discussed that...i actually read almost all the arguments, but to me it is murder, maybe not scientifically, but in my opinion, it is...i'm hard to understand, i know...but that's my opinion.

[*disco infiltrator*]

But it's not even living..in the first three weeks, all it is is a blob of cells. It's about as living as a rock. There's no heartbeat, brain, arms..anything. Highly resembles the sperm that made it.

[*Weird addiction*]

Yes i'm aware of that...but it's inside of me... lets say 3 months later, that little thing with no arms/legs... will actually turn out to be a living thing IN me... i don't know but i become emotional when talking about abortion...tell you the truth, i don't really like children but still...

[*CrackedRearView*]

Sandra, you're bringing up points that have already been discussed.

We've already proven that fetuses in the first three weeks aren't living at all, whatsoever and embryos throughout first trimester aren't scientifically considered to be living, even though some people morally consider them living.

Therefore, aborting in the first trimester of pregnancy (when most abortions are done) isn't murder at all. For something to die, it has to be living first.

How have you proven this? You haven't proven this to me at all...

Within the first three weeks of pregnancy, the fetus develops a heartbeat, and several other characteristics that would lead me to believe it's wrong to suck it out of a tube. The fetus, at this point, is already neurologically developing past the point of thousands of animal species (many of which I'm sure most of the people in this thread would argue need protection). Why does this logic extend to protect a certain animal, and not a human fetus?

EDIT:

But it's not even living..in the first three weeks, all it is is a blob of cells. It's about as living as a rock. There's no heartbeat, brain, arms..anything. Highly resembles the sperm that made it.

Wrong. The pulse develops at around 18-21 days (do the math on what week that lies within), the point at which arms, legs, digits, a rib cage, and many other uncanny human characteristics are visible (thanks to Campbell's ultrasound technology). And even then, it's likely that hardly any abortions occur before the heartbeat is developed.

[*disco infiltrator*]

The unused eggs that get "cancelled" when you have your period. They too have the potential to be life.

edit;;
Blah, I can't find the information online right now, but last trimester we had a section in our Bio book comparing fetuses between a pig, human, and fish in the third week of pregnancy. The pig and human fetuses were extremely similar with the same amount of brain waves omitted. The fish had a bit less, and was a different color. All were the same shape and size.

And Sandra, what if giving birth could kill the mother?

[*Weird addiction*]

Ok i just asked my mom and the fetus is alive within the first 3 weeks

[*RockizLife*]

You screwed around. You deal with the consequences. Don't murder an innocent child because of your stupid mistake. Sex=baby. If you don't want a baby, don't have sex. That simple. No one knows what that aborted baby could have been. He/she could've been the next president, or the next Einstein. Even a doctor that could've found the cure for all cancer. I don't care if they are the mother or father of the child. They don't have the right to steal that child's life because they were to stupid not to realize "Oh, if I have sex, I might have a baby! Maybe I shouldn't have sex!" My nephew Christian is a perfect example. My sister had him at 17 and she could have aborted him, but she didn't. The doctors actually said abortion would be the best choice. Now he's two, going on three and he is the most precious child I have ever met in my life and the smartest. He is a joy to our entire family. Sure, my sis messed up, screwed around, but she was strong enough to face her mistake and have that child. Abortion is the wimps way out. If you have an abortion, you're no more of a person then that unborn child. You're a murderer. Sorry if I sound harsh, that's just my opinion.

[*disco infiltrator*]

And I asked my mom and she said it wasn't.

[*CrackedRearView*]

RockizLife, you don't have to tell us that.

Even Sammi and Acid know; most all abortions happen because a teenage girl was stupid and didn't use contraceptives.

You really don't have to tell them that; they know.

[*Weird addiction*]

And I asked my mom and she said it wasn't.

LMAO! someone has to be wrong...i wish i could ask my dad but he doesn't live with me ...

[*RockizLife*]

I wasn't telling them that. Just my general opinion on abortion.

[*disco infiltrator*]

You screwed around. You deal with the consequences. Don't murder an innocent child because of your stupid mistake. Sex=baby. If you don't want a baby, don't have sex. That simple. No one knows what that aborted baby could have been. He/she could've been the next president, or the next Einstein. Even a doctor that could've found the cure for all cancer. I don't care if they are the mother or father of the child. They don't  have the right to steal that child's life because they were to stupid not to realize "Oh, if I have sex, I might have a baby! Maybe I shouldn't have sex!" My nephew Christian is a perfect example. My sister had him at 17 and she could have aborted him, but she didn't. The doctors actually said abortion would be the best choice. Now he's two, going on three and he is the most precious child I have ever met in my life and the smartest. He is a joy to our entire family. Sure, my sis messed up, screwed around, but she was strong enough to face her mistake and have that child. Abortion is the wimps way out. If you have an abortion, you're no more of a person then that unborn child. You're a murderer. Sorry if I sound harsh, that's just my opinion.

1. What Justin said is true. We know this. I don't think that's right either, however, there are other reasons why people get abortions. Perhaps you should read through the thread and know what I actually support before reitterating what has already been pounded into my head to the infinitieth power.

2. The child could also grow up to be Hitler, who was almost aborted and indirectly caused the killing of my great-grandmother. Definitely not a perfect little joy to my life. What's your point?



Sandra, my mom's studying to be a nurse, and that's why I asked her a while ago. Her teacher even said my boyfriend and I can go debate with her college class about abortion when it comes up too, woohoo. And she said most of the people in her class are her age, which should prove to be fun...

[*Weird addiction*]

Sammi my mom IS a nurse, well she stopped practising now... she's going into "business" ... you are lucky, all i get to debate about is pocket money raise ...

To answer your last question, if the woman should die giving birth to her baby, at least she died saving a life...you know the woman can also die by aborting a baby...

[*RockizLife*]

1. What Justin said is true. We know this. I don't think that's right either, however, there are other reasons why people get abortions. Perhaps you should read through the thread and know what I actually support before reitterating what has already been pounded into my head to the infinitieth power.

2. The child could also grow up to be Hitler, who was almost aborted and indirectly caused the killing of my great-grandmother. Definitely not a perfect little joy to my life. What's your point?
Sandra, my mom's studying to be a nurse, and that's why I asked her a while ago. Her teacher even said my boyfriend and I can go debate with her college class about abortion when it comes up too, woohoo. And she said most of the people in her class are her age, which should prove to be fun...

Yeah, I know. I wasn't talking directly to you. Just sharing my opinion. I am fully aware of your opinions, and I have read the entire thread, thank you

Yeah, I'm not saying they couldn't grow up to be bad. Doubt very seriously another Hitler. Sorry about your grandmother. I hate Hitler more then any being that has ever lived. But that's another issue. It's still that childs life. Not the parents. They have no right to take it away.

To answer your last question, if the woman should die giving birth to her baby, at least she died saving a life...you know the woman can also die by aborting a baby...

Exactly. I'd rather die then go on living knowing I killed my child.

[medic]

2. The child could also grow up to be Hitler, who was almost aborted and indirectly caused the killing of my great-grandmother. Definitely not a perfect little joy to my life. What's your point?

What’s your point, or no - you don't have one. That’s why you had to use Hitler to justify what you are saying.

I don’t justify what Hitler did to the Jewish society, but he was a genius. He got into the political fabric of the Nazi Germany, over-ran his superiors in power. Then after all of that he let his power get to his head, and used his own power against him. He killed himself the day he won his political seat in the German government.