So, why is it that you require proof and evidence for other beliefs but not your own religious beliefs?
Why would you believe something for which you have no proof?
What are you trying to argue here?



Burden of proof, dummy.

which is what i'm trying to explain. how are you to say that you're right or i'm right? you can't. how many times must i explain this? i have faith that my religion is right, just as you have faith that it's not. you come up with your own preferences(sp?) about certain things.

I wasn't "using faith as a defense," kthx.

what we you using it as?

Well, athiests / agnostics tend to base their beliefs by logic, not faith. I agree, I think its impossible to prove either side right or wrong. But if you really do feel that way, and if you're going to keep bringing that up, then what's the point in you *trying* to debate?

christianity has logic too.
i do feel that way, as alot of other people. the point of debating is being open-minded. why do you debate if you agree with that statement?

How so, when it is based upon faith?
I'm not saying that it's impossible for Christianity to be correct... I'm just trying to debate over why I think its highly unlikely.

but you asked me why i was trying to debate at all. what's the point?
anyways, there is as much evidence behind the idea that there is a god as much as there is evidence as there being no god. all religions involve faith. christianity included. it's not based solely on faith. one theory has to be right, and they all involve faith. you have faith in your belifs, i have faith in mine.

And that's fine. I actually believe in God... I thought you would have caught on by now. I dont really believe in him/her or whatever by faith - I've just never seen enough evidence to disprove his existance. So I agree with you on that one. But Christianity is totally different, just like any other religion.

Nah, I dont really have "faith" in my beliefs at all. My beliefs have been established by logic.

This doesn't prove that God is different from an imaginary friend, but I thought it'd be fit here, and it may or may not of been brought up somewhere else, but:

Pascal's Wager

You bet there is a God:
There is a God: you win everything.
There isn't a God: you lose nothing.

You bet there isn't a God:
There is a God: you lose everything.
There isn't a God: you lose nothing.

i know that you do. i didn't say that you didn't.
christianity is totally different from what? you really should be more specific.
not to mention you just contradicted yourself in saying that you do believe in god by "logic". you said before that you were just "trying to debate why you think that it's highly unlikely". you also said that it didn't have much logic.

It's not like the concept of God is completely illogical. In fact, when getting everything straight, it's quite logical.

It's like being a fan of a famous person, and then being a fan of a famous person and knowing how they got where they are now, how they work, their philosophy on life, and etcetera.

You can't prove a negative. It's impossible.

Instead, we can say it's "Highly unlikely" there's no such thing as God, but we can't be certain.

And God is completely irrelevant from everything anyway. It's not like he's damaging my, or anyone elses, quality of life..


- James.

Well, it just kinda sounded like you did.
It and any other religion is different from Athiesm and Agnosticism. Sorry for not being specific, but I thought it'd be obvious what I was talking about.

When did I say that I didnt have much logic? Yeah, I did say that it's highly unlikely that Christianity is accurate, not the basic concept of a God. So what are you getting at? I didnt contradict myself at all.

QUOTE(Arjuna Capulong @ May 23 2007, 04:01 PM)

It's like being a fan of a famous person, and then being a fan of a famous person and knowing how they got where they are now, how they work, their philosophy on life, and etcetera.

That's called stalking.

The thing is, is that there's no "right" side. But that's the point of a debate. If there was one side that was right it wouldn't a debate at all. The thing that's hard for anyone of any religion is to prove that their god does actually exsist. Call me lame, but those who do have a god, the proof lies in how you believe in that god. Someone who would give up on their god doesn't have much of belief that their god actually does exsist. For all we know there might be no god. I think the reason we have gods and religion is to give us some sort of hope of the unknown of what happens to us after we die; what I believe is a whole other subject.

Ick, overusage of the word "god".

Anyways, there is as much evidence behind the idea that there are fairies living in my basement as there is evidence as there being no fairies living in my basement.

Still sound so convincing?

hmmm . . . there is no way to prove that God exists or is real. yes, there is a lot of evidence for Him. There is also a lot of evidence for evolution. it just depends on how you look at things and/or twist them, the same discoveries can be used for or against God/intelligent design. i think belief in God is an act of faith. it's impossible to see Him or prove Him. the same goes for evolution or atheism. it's faith cause you can't prove it. God's invisible, just like an imaginary friend. He defies logic, so you can't prove Him with logical arguments. one thing i do know, though, is that the Bible is too accurate to be made up by insane men. either it's the biggest conspiracy on the face of the planet or it's the 100% truth. personally, i find it hard to believe that the apostles and Jesus would have given their lives for something they were making up and knew was a hoax. that's not a fairtale. there is historical evidence for all that the bible records about them. what they did wasn't exactly making them rich and famous. i wouldn't die for nothing, and i don't think the millions of other marders would've, either.

also, how could so many people over as many years as it took to write the bible all say the same thing without even knowing each other? it would take a super natural force just to create the conspiracy, lol. invisible people can't write books, either. anyhow, all this talk isn't gonna make anyone believe anything. if you do believe in God, don't talk about it; do it. Christians who are all talk and like "prove God doesn't exist" drive me nutso. just be who you are and true to what you believe. if you don't believe in God, that's your business, not mine. don't get in my face and tell me what i believe is insane if i'm not in your face calling you insane. i'm not calling anyone insane. people are smart. just don't think it's your right to push your morality on me.

you might be able to prove the existence of jesus and some of the old happenings of the bible, but as everyone has pointed out earlier, religion is largely based on faith. "thou shall not put the lord to the test." pretty sure it says that somewhere.

if scientests can prove the existence of jesus and old bible scripture, it would be cool if they could prove some of revalations, for example: astronomy related revalations and apacolyptic revolations.

I guess i do base my believes on faith aswell as the bibles teachings. Whether God maybe real or not, I choose to believe in him. For me it's mostly based on faith and the comfort i feel when I speak to him. Idk but i rather believe in God, and one day find out he doesn't exsist, than not believe in him at all, and find out he does. He gives me a purpose in life, aswell as too many others. so yeah^-^

So "Imaginary" or not, I believe in him (:

It's too bad this turned into another "prove that God exists" discussion.

Proving that he's not imaginary, or different than something imaginary and proving that he exists is a fine line.

This is how I know God from imaginary.

God have numerous ways to speaking to you. He is you conscious. He is your instincts. He can be that little voice in your head. He can speak to you through another person. You would never know how he is going to come at you. All you have to do is listen and pay attention but it's easy to get caught up. It feels real, and you just know when it's him but watch out for the disguise.

But mostly it just feels right.

^ But how can you be so sure of that? What if we are subconsciously our own conscious? Both humans and animals are born with their own distinct insincts.

The claim that "he can speak to you through another person" is no more believable than thinking that trees can speak to you through another person.

What disguise are you referring to? Satan?

You would just know when its God. God can indeed talk to you through another person, you never know how God is going to use people. Now do not be funny, we all know trees cannot talk through people . For the disguise, yes most likely I am referring to Satan. He is the greatest trickster. Trickery is his tool.