Rebecca - LOL I try not to go postal on people like that, but you never know when it's gonna happen.

Alright, I understand that this isn't Diana's point in this topic, but anyway.

Disagreeing me is hardly taking away the "fun", you're taking what I said into an entirely different context. That's alright. Let me explain why I don't think doing the IP check is a big deal or anything to get upset over.

For one, only four people on this site (five, I guess, Jusun has been around lately) currently have the power to do the advanced IP check. The other staff members can SEE IPs in their respective forums, but unless they go around individually comparing IP addresses, it's highly unlikely that more than a couple of people will find out who's on the duplicate account.

For two, when those three or four people DO find out who that user is, the reason they've been given that responsibility is because they're mature enough to handle keeping a secret when it shouldn't be leaked to the rest of the community. I didn't go running backstage to tell everyone, I didn't go tell the people in the chat, I understood that she hadn't done anything wrong and at that point I didn't need to say anything.

Anyway, I see something out of the ordinary and I check it out. Again, I don't see what's wrong with knowing if it's handled correctly, and since I know that it irks people when I say something about it, I'll be sure not to mention it in the future.

Now I totally understand that sometimes people might be afraid to say something negative about me or Rebecca, or one of the admins, and for some reason might not want us to know it's them. First of all, I'd like to say that we are all very approachable people and we know to take criticism seriously without getting defensive. If anyone's afraid to say something negative about us or tell us what they think we should be doing differently, by all means, don't be! But if you really don't want us to know it's you, you can PM an admin to have them post it anonymously for you, and if you don't want THEM to know who you are, they both have AIM accounts or you can e-mail them. I hope nobody's scared of us, though. Again, sorry for dragging this off the original topic, I hope I was able to tie things in at least somewhat.

And with that, I'm late for work, so. *runs out the door*

Alright, although it's good to stay on topic. I think that it's rediculous for people to be "forced" to walk this ridged line to stay "on topic". There may be several issues surrounding a topic that seem so far "off topic" that we may fail to recognize their relevancy to the topic.

We need to stop being so strict if we're going to get anywhere. I guess I just don't think you should have appologized. I think that what you brought up was one of the underlying or invisible issues surrounding the topic at hand and it needed to be addressed. For people to acuse you of being "off topic" is just plain ignorant.

Diana, people will automatically assume certain ties when it comes to certian mods, it's ineveitable. If someone posted anonymously, people will still think "Oh, so and so probably egged this on."

Just for the record, if someone gives me valid criticism in Mod Preview, I'll take it, address it, and either move on or adapt. No one needs to be afraid. I would also point out that (I'm alomst certain) every single member of staff has said at on epoint or another that they welcome criticism. So if people are afraid, or nervous, or whatever, there is precisely NO reason for this. The only time people will be short with them is if they are making unfair, ungrounded, or personal remarks.

As long as criticism is constructive, that is what the thread is there for.

Alright James, well just to give you an understanding of how you treated me when I DID decide to talk about something with you:

I said:

"Thank you...

You have to understand why I'm skeptical though... it just seems to convenient for you to come out of no-where thinking it was a great idea as soon as Ju-sun came in posting his thoughts. I guess you really give me the impression that you out of your way to disagree with me in every way you possibly can. It's as if it benefits you to think it's a great idea all of the sudden because Ju-sun might see your post.

If you're just disagreeing with the things that I post because you don't like me then I would rather you keep your comments to yourself... w/e it just disappoints me that you're so supportive as soon as Ju-sun comes on back, and when he's not around it seems as if you're just a bitter jerk to me. It just makes you look fake to me."

I truely felt my comments were constructive. I felt a certain way, I expressed it without without tearing you down, and I ended it with a solution ("If you're just disagreeing with the things that I post because you don't like me then I would rather you keep your comments to yourself".)

You responded telling me to "grow up" and ended your response telling me "You're not that interesting." No offense, but the way you replied to me is exacly the reason people are afraid to speak up.

See, I read that PM and it comes off as personal to me. (And no, I'm not siding with anyone here, just saying what my initial reaction is after reading that post). That's not to say how James responded was the best way of communicating either.

BUT, that type of response isn't really moderator feedback, it's James feedback. Meaning, you were put off by him agreeing with you because you felt it was in conjuction with the site creator's return. That has nothing to do with his job as a moderator here.

Just my opinion.

I understand what you are trying to relate here, Josh. I just don't think that was a good example.

I stipulated both constructive and, crucially, valid. You were repeating things I had already dealt with several times. I should perhaps have mentioned that the criticism should also be fresh and not repetitive.

I'm sorry if that mislead you.



And also, I'm not having this argument with you again, and certainly not in this thread, so do try not to fall back into the same old rut if at all avoidable.
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Rebecca, DO stop beating me to things.

If users are given the chance to avoid conflict by posting anonymously, how will that affect the future promotions of staff members?

^Explain please?

Possibly he means that people can act up anonymously, and then still apply for staff? I don't really know, but that seems a valid enough concern.

James, you tried to "tell me off" (for lack of a better word). Your post seemed insulting, looming, and arrogant.

It's as if every time I had it up you find a way to insult me. I don't know what literature your reading, but most of the conflict management book I have read don't suggest "insults". I keep repeating it because you insult me. It's consistent James, and you have never once had empathy with me. You have never once shown me that you were willing to make an attempt to understand me, and if you did I apologize for not recognizing it and I would like you to post an example so that I can understand.



James is a moderator... I went to him with my problem and he gave me an insulting response.

Yes, my problem was with him. He's a moderator, and it was disappointing for me to see a Moderator give my ideas negative reviews and then change his mind in what seemed conjoined with the site creators return. It lead me to believe that he has a personal problem with me. I addressed my issue with James and received an insulting response. I feel as if the problem with me is effecting his ability to make clear headed decisions and perform as a moderator. I feel that he moderates unfairly when making decisions that effect me and members that share my ideas.

There is conflict, it effects the members of this site, and it needs to be resolved. I see it as more than just personal.

I guess this leads me to ask the question... What type of problems should be brought up in feedback? What should be considered too personal?

I was wondering whether it would be a good idea or not to grant people the chance to post feedback anonymously.

At that time I typed that I was thinking of a case in which a person who has never dared to post feedback openly, and now has been promoted to a staff position. This new mod receives negative criticism by an anonymous poster, how would the person react?

I honestly don't know the answer, so I thought I would ask. >_>

Changing subjects, answering to the opening post:

I personally would aim for a solution that aimed towards putting staff members and normal users closer. A staff member isn't the "Fist of Ju-Sun" and shouldn't be seen as someone with the ability to punish, only; there are hiring sessions for volunteers for a reason x(.

I think it would be more helpful to try to approach positions first than add features that could be interpreted as distancing staff members from regular users, in the worst of cases.

If the part you quoted is what you consider my "reason" for doing the IP check, it's not. If you'd like to read it, it was explained very clearly in the rest of my post. We could go around in circles on this (if we aren't already), but it's clear at this point that you and I are not going to see eye to eye on this issue. I'm finding my happy place and going back to your regularly scheduled doormat whom everyone seems to get along with better.

..Or maybe it's just me not being a bitch, I'm not sure at which point on the line this falls.

No you read me right. I meant going back to being a doormat = stop being a bitch, because the two can very easily be misconstrued you see.

I may have taken things a bit too personally, but I guess that's what comes with actually caring. I do feel as if things are continuously getting more uptight, but with all of us being in such bad moods, how could it NOT be? I do miss the way we all used to get along - it seems like there are several groups here, and none of them get along with any of the others most of the time. To be fair, there are a lot of good things about CB, otherwise I'd have been long gone with all the other people who didn't want to deal with all the stress.

I can't decide between "DANI SMASH" (for no apparent reason) and waving my hands maniacally screaming "WHERE IS THE LOVE?!"

No, no, I like the new Dani. Keep it up. Remember, it's Dani Smash!!!, not Dani doormat. "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down that wall.." You need to let loose, make mistakes, and get MESSY!! Serious, bitch her out.

LOL I meant DANI SMASH in the sense that it tends to lighten the mood when I do it, because I'm not your typical "OMG RULE WITH AN IRON FIST OF DOOOOOOM" mod. :P

Anyway, I'll mention how you said that you don't think I should apologize for being slightly off-topic - I agree. This is what I'm talking about when I say things get taken too seriously or that the rules get taken too far. Certain things should just get overlooked because much of what gets punished around here really isn't a big deal.

edit; Nah, LOL. I'm not mad, you mad? I'm not.

Well, I thought about this.... it wouldn't be a bad idea if it wasn't' abused. This would give people the ability to be honest about their feelings towards staff members without having to fear their wrath. They would have to react as if they didn't know who it was.

I think that this idea might be a good one. It would keep staff with a personal bias towards certain members of the community from taking things said my those members out of context by holding the post to their expectations of that member.



I completely agree with you... I feel like the staff of cB treats us like we're lower than then. I feel like they talk down to us at times. The "Fist of Ju-sun" sounds like a great movie title... XD

I don't know what you're trying to say in the second half.

I CAN'T!!!
.


That was EXACTLY the whole point for my whole topic.For pussys LIKE ME to post what they thought about a mod without hearing them get all defensive about how they are doing their job.or how they have a life or whatever valid excuse ive seen in that thread.And so that their "homies" dont come swarming at the orignal poster about how they are so great and its their problem.The mod preformance thread reminds me of 26th street in chicago.You say something YOU GET JUMPED MO FUCKA.

That was my reasoning as to WHY this site should consider it.

Buuuut,this has now become a thread about privacy invasion and some other crap. and i feel like its my fault for starting this when all I meant was to give some "ideas" in feedback.

this thread is going to give me a heart attack.I swear to god.

I don't know if you're a pussy. I just think that you know how cB works. I see it all the time. You say something about someone, and you get the shaft for saying it. It's as if they hold a grudge against you, or they have their buddies tear you apart.

There are a lot of underlying issues here though. I mean, what's causing people to do this and how can we prevent situations like this from happening? I think that some of the cB staff is too immature to handle negative feedback, and need a lesson in conflict management.







The things that you guys are talking about are "underlying issues". They maybe completely relevant to the topic, I encourage you both to keep talking if you aren't finished. I think that part of the reason Dianna is suggesting anonymous posts in the feedback section is partly due to the fact that people DO take this website far to seriously and in the process hold grudges towards the people that felt like they were wronged enough to post about it.

Yeah I read through the thread a secondtime and saw that

i havent really been active for the past year or so, and dont have a thorough understanding of whats going on. so i think ill just say this right nwo, from an outsider's perspective who deeply cares about this community.

as josh mentioned, empathy. i think we lack this as a community, and is the cause behind most of the bickerings, personal attacks, the accusing and defending. and all for nothing too, as more harm than good comes out of it, all because no one's willing to listen and empathize.

if only more people were willing to listen first, and talk later, issues would be resolved a lot quicker. lets not forget that the staff members have done a tremendous job keeping this site going. but lets also remember that this site, being a community driven site, is made entirely possible by its members.

and if you feel youre not going anywhere with someone, please, instead of duking it out with one another across the forums, try having an uninvolved third party help resolve the dispute. im available, and im sure many others are as well.

it takes courage to admit a mistake. and it takes understanding to accept one. please, be more courageous! be more understanding!

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as for the topic starter, unfortunately its not possible to have an individual thread where staff members cant see the ips.

Omg, exactly... I couldn't have said it better myself.

Maybe we should consider a group on cb who have no moderation power but are here just to deal with members who dont get along.

As i recall in my middle school and high school we called them "peer mediators".
I think personaly that that would be the first step to peace.As Duking it out on the forum isnt alowed but even PM more than 70 percent of the time dont reslove any problems.

I dont know.Just a thought.

That sounds like a really neat idea Diana, in my opinion. I do agree that even though everyone says to go to PM's for problems or to clear things out with certain people it just doesn't ever work. And to have a third party in it as well I think that the whole peer mediators sounds like a neat idea. Although if it were in a forum how exactly would it work if some people don't want their problems with others open to everyone in cB?

I have had a reply in mind for a couple days, however I haven't been able to summarize it into a three or four paragraph post. Still, I would like to clarify my position about this subject even though Micron has covered part of what I intended to say.

First of all, I could see how the anonymous posting feature could be useful in some cases, but I wouldn’t go as far as calling that an improvement. There are some problems in online communities that do not have a virtual solution, but instead seem to demand the involvement of the users.

Trust problems or personal disputes (I don’t have an exact nomenclature for the issue Diana brought up) between users and staff members should be talked out. Even if the intervention of a 3rd or 4th figure is needed; being open to solve any problems seems a better option to me than to sweep things under the rug.

We do have the Moderator performance thread and the Feedback forum, as well as a wide range of staff members that can be contacted in case the subject that needs to be brought up for discussion is too delicate to be debated in an open environment. I would say that we already have the tools, what I feel we need to work on now is on our disposition to use them properly.

I am well aware that as people with a limited time to dedicate to CreateBlog and also with a limited experience in Internet community building efforts at first we will only be able to do so much in favor of a better communication between staff and regular users (and amongst each group, too).

Also, we can’t expect everyone to be willing to talk things out since everybody has a different degree of involvement with CreateBlog as well as a different way to deal with stuff. I consider the core of my post to be more of a personal decision rather than a general policy. Ultimately, it’s your own decision to make CB lean one way or another with the way you choose to act.

Even after having considered these facts, I am still in favor of direct user involvement over anonymous posting. A higher level of communication could eliminate some of the obstacles between staff members and users. It would help older members to get along together, and it would also set a good example for newer members of the site.

In a way, not only we’d be doing it for ourselves and the present CB members, but also we would be investing in the future “promotions” of Cbers at the same time.