because of the recent debate i've been having in the "Jesus... is he Gay?" thread, i've decided to make a new thread so that I can argue eith ppl and not be off-topic. When anyone is ready, ill start the assault.

I'm not "religous" I'm standing up for what I believe in (God and that Jesus died on the cross). These topics should seriously be closed, because there is no point in arguing about it, none of this is going to change anyones mind. There's absolutely no reason for these topics, in my opinion.

religion shoudnt be a topic to argue about. you either accept and follow it or dont.

im not religious

Not true because I got rid of christianity in this way : i was a devout christian. I studied the bible, but as I thought about it more I questioned it more. Then I got into a argument with afriend about religion and he totally changed my mind on the subject. Given facts ad using logic, u can get rid of a person's misperceptions. If you can give me a good argument, u just may change someone's life. I mean isn't that how religions are started!

That is a case by case situation. I know some people who you could argue the crap out of them and they still would never go against their religion. Some people you can convince with logic, others are too stubborn.

There's been two God threads; one with 50 pages, the other with 20.

So I'll just rename this God III, then, if we're going to debate God's existence?

Why, did Jesus hurt you when you were a boy?

Hahaha, that sounds like a software.

"Hey kids I just downloaded God Beta 1.5"

o god did not hurt me as a boy stupid.
i just find it a relevant topic that people will go against logic ad rason to believe these insane ideas.
o and i like the fact that ppl are saying this thread woont get anything solved because that meas you understand that some people will never give up somethig like religion no matter how much it has been disproven

I'll get one thing straight right off the bat; I'm an atheist and I don't believe in a God or Higer Being/Power, etc.

HOWEVER...

what I don't understand is why people must SUPPRESS religion so. You say that people refuse to give up something even though it has been disproven - have you ever thought about why?

People simply don't care that it has been disproven. When you break it down, religion helps people. It is an emotional and spiritual crutch for people, and it guides them throughout life. I don't know about you, but that sounds like a good thing to me.

And my question is...why must you so passionately suppress a good thing?

Michael says it the best.

ur getting me wrong im not trying to supress religion ( i could't do that if i dedicated my life to it) and yes i do know that religion "helps" people.(Iused to use it to guide my life and i looked for scripture when i had problems.)

anyways i dont view religion as a good thing. It clouds peoples judgement, gives them false hope, and ultimately lies to them. Its like telling a person, about to die, and someone reassuring you that you'll be fine. It's comforting but to what point and purpose?that they'll be fine. Or aYes, people have had better lives but for what purpose?God takes the individuality out of people.

But it makes people feel better. Sure, the hope may be false, but at least it's hope that something better is to come. Some people don't need that hope, but some do. Why not leave them be? Leave them alone and they'll leave you alone too.

I'm an atheist as well, but you're going a bit overboard to the offensive. You should not try to push your beliefs on others. That's like Evangelism, only..not Christianity.

There's a reason people are Christian. It gives them something to look forward to and a way to reward themselves for following moral guidelines. Some people need that. I agree people shouldn't just be a way because a book said so, but some people want to. So leave them be.

Why do you feel the need to force everyone into having the same belief system as yourself? You need to grow up and realize that you alone cannot be only and completely right about everything (weird for me to say that, cause you're 2 months older than me, according to the birthday on your profile). Be more mature about the situation, hm?

whilst it may not strictly be the same as my opinion, i do kind of understand the thought behind this topic.



there are other, and in some cases better, ways to gain hope. Using Christian values to live one's life, whilst practicing Buddhist meditation, for example, would not be classed as being religious, but in most cases increases the security a person feels, and makes them happier.



Almost every religion tries to push it's beliefs on others. Jehovah's Witnesses are the most persistant buggers ever, but i don't dislike them in the slightest - i can tolerate them. which is what you're suggesting.
And anyway, Christianity pushes tolerance as a value, so why should Christians be particularly bothered? To me it sounds as if the most of the people arguing about this are in fact "atheists" (the quotation marks because it's touchy what an atheist really is - it's too broad an umbrella)




it's not immature to try and encourage reasoned discussion. this person has had a change of heart in their core beliefs - i don't think that it is in any way a bad thing that they should wish to share this.

But the way this guy is doing it isn't good. Sharing intelligent debate is one thing - offending others and having the "you must be this way or you're stupid" mentality is another.

oh wow, do you just WANT to argue about this? i mean there really isnt any point in argueing about this...like dreamguy was saying....but i AM RELIGIOUS. why? you may ask. because God created me. did the first people to walk this earth get here? a peanut? is that how science proved it? oh please tell me its science. entertain me a little bit. come on. PUULLEAAZEEEEeeeEe if you want to argue about it i'm ready.

on the nicer side........you can beleive whatever you want to beleive, no need to argue about it...you have the choice to beleive in whatever you want to believe. but you my friend, it sounds like you're trying to convince everyone that there is no God and he never existed and that everything you say is right and thats that.
THAT MY FRIEND IS CALLED ARROGANCE!
but yeahhh...that is all i have to say for now

im agnostic.

i want to believe. i want to be just as religious as my friends. but for some reason, i cant believe.


i answered the question. what are we debating?

Wow, you pulled a me! Or... Have I been pulling a you this entire time? *eerie music plays*

As far as anything regarding religion, I personally don't debate about it unless someone's trying to change my views on it. I also personally don't care if this fictional character Jesus was gay or not.

a little, but i wont take jokes about my religion to serious and im real open to other religions

wow..... you'd rather ppl act like sheep so that they can feel good about themselves........damn i ca't stad weak minded ppl

I don't know what that was a response to, but I guess I'll share my views off of that.

I don't like Christianity. The easiest way to make a case that there is no Christian god is to read the bible. Most Christians haven't even read the damn book, and my atheist friends know more about it than the Christians do. The bible is a case against intelligence, and I can't respect that.
I respect Buddhism because it seems to carry the most truth, and is the least abraisive about the spirituality part. There are some theories in this philosophy that are fun to speculate, but are nearly impossible to prove, such as chakras and karma. All the figure heads of this religion are extremely intelligent and balanced individuals, and I hold high respect for that.

I was born and raised catholic for the first year of my life, then moved over to that general christian thing until I was in middleschool, then when I was smart enough to choose my own religion instead of subscribing to the easy answers, I chose Buddhism. Just as of recently, I've renounced my faith in anything but science and what I can see is real. This is why I don't think I have a proper footing to convince any sheep of any sort of improper thought unless I can prove the opposite of their case, which isn't possible with anything relating to faith, IMHO. Faith, once founded, is separate and sometimes an opposite to logic. Fighting something with logic that is obviously not logic at all is counterproductive, because both sides could be wrong, but neither will concede defeat, and there is no way to tell, even if a side does "lose".

somehow you put my thoughts into words.

you just seem really ignorant.

im almost athiest.. but i understand the purpose of religion. it provides people with hope, it gives them a reason to live. peoples children who die can turn to their faith for comfort..

at least understand that.

i understand that its convenient.
my question is can you understand that its a sad thing that people have to cloud their vision just so that they can feel good about themselves. Religion makes people so dependant, sometimes almost helpless without it.
more later(ive got hw)

Before I start, I'd like you to know that I'm an agnostic, who came from from a family of devout Buddhists and Catholics. I completely understand where you're coming from when you say that religion make one dependent and helpless. I'm somewhat of a humanist, and I believe that we, naturally, have strengths to overcome certain obstacles which religion claims only a higher power can help us. I also believe in the human mind, that in the right environment—not necessarily the best one, can hold together under oppression and hardships of any kind.

With that said, I think your views are somewhat similar to a philosopher I once read. He believes that religion, namely Christianity, makes man weak, corrupted even, and that those who can resist the lure religion become a "higher" type of man—one that is superior to all the rest. Though I have much respect for this philosopher, I cannot dare agree to this view completely.

If you so believe in humanity, in that a person can make his/her own decisions, and overcome all things, you have a right to believe it. However, in the same rationale, you must also trust a person, believe that he/she will make the decision that will most benefit himself, even if religion is the final decision. Choosing religion does not make him pathetic, or weak, it makes him human; a human whose mind has failed him in some way. No, that was not an insult, it was an observation. The said failing may be distrust of friends and family or disappointment in life. Instinctively, the mind reaches out for whatever it is that can right the failing. Religion, or developing all kinds of concepts and ideals, may be some things to correct it. Again, this is the human thing to do.

This post has been edited by Spirited Away: Nov 21 2005, 03:06 PM

To answer the question, no, I am not religious. I am an atheist, in fact.

Religion is a choice, just as atheism and agnosticism are choices. Everything we do in this lifetime, in my opinion, is a choice made by us. Non-harmful choices are intended to be respected and tolerated, no matter how much we may disagree with them. Therefore, if a person chooses to be religious, we cannot disregard that choice. We must accept it and respect it, no matter how much we may disagree with it.