My answer to this question is simply, I don't know.

Where as Calvanists believe that there is no absolute free-will, there are others who believe that there is free-will, and that somehow free-will and omniscience can work together. I myself have not come to the conclusion on whether or not I believe that we have free-will or not. I have tried to answer your question with some example or a metaphor of some time, but I realized until I myself decide on whether free will truly exists or not, I will not be able to answer.

Of course, your question rather pertains to different branches and theology within the Christian Community. I think it would be a little different between other branches.

As being nondenominational, I can't tell yet. Hopefully I can answer this question later on down the road, but again, I cannot at this point.

Why does God hate non-republicans?

Who doesn't?

Black people

ok what's the difference between christianity and catholic again? so what caused humans to "mess up" when first created, so now there's a whole bunch of other religions and non believers? wouldn't that be the fault of the first people created, and we as non believers or people who believe in other religion are just born to carry their sins ?

Catholics and Christians are different in the way they carry about things, and the doctrines they believe in.

Here is a detailed description from a Catholic side of view.

http://www.justforcatholics.org/a19.htm

Also, temptation caused us to sin, or to "mess up." And yes, it's the fault of our predecessors, Adam and Eve.

There are two views to this. One is that there was federal imputation, meaning that Adam was a representative for all human kind, so his actions spoke for all. The other view is that it happened seminally. Because we are tied to Adam biologically, sin is passed from one human to another.

i don't get why god got so worked up over them sinning and decided to punish us all for thousands of years over it. it's not as if he didn't know what was going to happen, since he's all knowing ya know.

and i really just don't think it's fair to punish everyone, even though none of us had anything to do with what adam and eve did. this is like me wanting to punish all the white kids my age because they might have an ancestor who was a slave owner. that would make no sense, seeing how neither of us had anything to do with what might have happened a long time go between our ancestors.

Yes, but again, you don't necessarily have the right to punish anyone.

Seriously, you seem to take the whole punishing thing to another level and equating it with some sadistic thing. God isn't sadistic! Hell was originally created for Satan and his demons. Since God is perfect and holy, he can't be in the presence of sin. Thus, when humans die and the soul is wandering, there are only two places you can be. Hell or Heaven. And if Jesus of Nazareth isn't there to bridge you and God, then you can only go to another place. God doesn't like punishing people, but since he is two-dimensional, he can only do so.

if god was really the merciful god he's supposed to be, then i don't see why anyone needs to go burn in hell forever. why can't his faithful followers who "serve" him go spend eternity with him in heaven and the rest of us just cease to exist. just die and that be that, why do they need to suffer eternally. if god is all powerful i don't see what the big deal is with this.

Let me try to explain again.

When a human dies, their soul is to go one of either two places. Heaven or hell. God obviously wants everyone to go to Heaven, but again, he can't be in the presence of sin, so if you don't have Jesus Christ, then there's nothing you can do.

There is nothing else I can explain more on this topic. You might think that God is sadistic. But he's truly not. That's why he sent Jesus to help us all. But if you ignore yourself to God's true calling to you and if you ignore him, then that is your consequence.

Hell is a consequence of you ignoring him. You can enjoy your life now and do whatever you want, and when you die, you can go to hell.

It's vice-versa for us. We are in a complete life of servitude for him, and when we die, we will inherit his kingdom. But of course, it's not about going to heaven. It's about being able to serve a being much greater than us, and that being noticing us.

i'd still argue if he's all powerful, this is how he wants it. he wants people to burn, otherwise he would just make it so they cease to exist and didn't get the prize of spending eternity with him in heaven. but i understand there's nothing else to say on this as long as u think god is limited to only two ways to go

I'm going to use the same analogy as before. I love children, thus I hate abortion. If you love one thing, you're bound to hate the other.

i mean i get what ur saying on that, but to me it's not realistic. to apply that 100% to something, reality isn't that black and white.

i love kids, and hate abortion.
BUT
i hate abortion as an easy way out for girls who were irresponsible and got pregnant. i don't hate abortion for a woman who was raped and has no control over the fact she's pregnant. for me, just because i love something, doesn't mean i have to hate the other in every single instance possible.

I thought god was omnipotent? Are you saying he isn't all-powerful?
Wow, Christianity makes so much sense.

I did say that God was omnipotent. Being completely perfect means you cannot be in the presence of sin because it's just not possible.

Not because he cowers in sin.

You're just not reading/trying to niggle your way though debating.

1. The hell does being in the presence of something affect god's independent and individual perfection?
2. Even if your rebuttal made any sort of sense, why can't the omnibenevolent god choose, in his omnipotence, to place the non-believers and sinners into an entirely new realm - beyond heaven and hell (someplace where no suffering is necessary).
3. How is god just if he infinitely punishes us for finite crimes?
4. If non-belief is a natural result of the tools god gave us (intellect, honesty, and curiosity) and if we follow these tools dispassionately why must god feel such disdain? Aren't these truly the children he should love the most - for, as Ayn Rand put it, it is the atheists, the agnostics, and the free thinkers that have taken god most seriously.
5. Why the f**k do you still believe in fairy tales, how old are you?

1. I can't put this more clearly than I have said. If you are perfect, that means that you aren't even in the presence of imperfection.

2. Likewise, if you read the book by H.G. Wells' Time Machine, you can find what happens when there is no suffering. We all become weak, soft, and stupid. We become literally soft. Mankind has known from suffering and pain, and is unfortunately our only real way of learning.

3. We are taught that our God is two-dimensional, meaning that is the only one true just God. He is a loving God and also a just God. He treats all fairly and punishes all fairly. There is no bias. No bribery. No one side.

4. God feels disdain because you are using all the gifts that he's given you in a way that isn't what was meant for you to use.

5. Don't be a c**t.

it still seems like ur saying god is limited. he can only send someone to heaven or hell and that's all. i don't understand how an all powerful god would be limited like this. it seems an all powerful god could do what he wanted. so then i'd conclude he wants to send people to hell, because if he didn't want to do that, he would do something else. like i said earlier, just make it so when we non believers die we simply cease to exist. we wouldn't go to hell and suffer eternally for using our god given skills (like NoSex said, logic, reasoning, ect) and we wouldn't go to heaven and be in paradise because we don't deserve that. he still wouldn't have to be in our sinful presence that way.


and i think god is being a bit ridiculous to think he can give us these gifts and we will apply them to everything but him. but this doesn't really matter, because we've already been over the fact that i don't think a god who knows everything can really think, since there would be nothing to think about. a;ksjdf;laskjfasdf

I guess I feel like throwing out a question. Haven't been around here in a while.

If I love Jesus, does that make me gay?

Just kidding.


What's Christianity's reply to Islam being the "final revision" of God's word (since Judaism, Christianity, and Islam are all supposedly revisions of His word)?

yes

Why does Hell have to exist?

Why did God create us if he's self sufficient?

How can God know all things, yet give us the choice of love?

It's true. God doesn't think. He knows.

It is said in Timothy 4:1-3 1The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. 2Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. 3They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.

We believe that any religion other than God's word is known as a way that will only lead to a false idea, and a false life.

Islam is considered by us to be a completely different religion, because it denies the fact that Jesus Christ was the Messiah, and that some other person Mohammed, had last contact with God.

Just the Jesus part alone is enough to make it a completely different religion.

Hell was originally created for Satan and his demons.

He created us out of the goodness of his heart.

Again, if it's the argument against free will vs. omniscience, I don't know yet. I still haven't taken a stand on either side yet.

1. How does the presence of imperfection logically affect the perfection of an independent quality? Further, if god is omnipresent, isn't he always in the presence of all imperfection at all time? Even further, god isn't material, is he? If he is, then, how can he ever be in the presence of anything?
2. God, in his omnipotence, can simply teach us by means of magical Christian voodoo. Seriously, if god is all powerful he should be able to think up far more benevolent ways (especially given his omnibenevolence) to "teach" us. But, more importantly, your answer ignored my question. How is suffering in hell necessary? If hell is eternal what is the purpose of learning - you'll always just be stuck in hell.
3. This isn't an answer, you're just begging the question ad nauseam. How is it just to punish finite crimes infinitely?
4. So, we aren't supposed to honestly investigate the existence of god? We're just supposed to accept that he is there? And, further, what the hell is up his ass - I mean, I've heard of controlling, but, f**k! That doesn't sound like love, that sounds like megalomania.
5. No.

If Hell was originally created for Satan and his Demons then at what point did God say, "Awwww, what the fuck. Let's just send people who don't believe in me down there too." Why does God send people to hell?

Why did God create sin in the first place?

If God created sin then wouldn't that mean that he's sinning... it's indirect, but it's sin. If it wasn't for God then we wouldn't be able to sin in the first place. Is God a sinner?

Explain...

Alright, no problem.

I'm not a christian, but I feel like taking a stab at this. All of this is what I think, not know, so sorry if I get any of it wrong :D

God created Hell to send Satan there for being a very bad boy! I believe with this punishment, he also decided to punish Satan by sending him all the people who chose to be sinners/bad people/etc. Double punishment, they're damned for eternity, and Satan has to deal with them.

Okay, your faith is based on a bible that was written in Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek. It was then translated into Latin thousands of times over before ever being translated into English, which I am assuming is your native language.
So you are telling me that your faith in God, what you are devoting your life to, is in the hands of some men you have never met and their translating abilities?
English is baby talk compared to these other languages. Who knows what "virgin Mother" meant then, or "being swallowed by a whale". What about the burning bush? Or the angels coming from the sky? WHO KNOWS what that meant back then? Who knows if that is even what they wrote? I mean every version of the bible you get is different.
I think if there is a God we have it all wrong, he is not a parental figure in the sky that loves and waits for us to join him on a nice fluffy cloud in heaven. He doesn't watch our every move and know everything about us. He doesn't curse us with bad things if we have pre-marital sex. He just doesn't care, if he is there he is something beyond what the bible could explain, even if it had been written in English.

The bible is so full of hocus pocus, but you don't want kids to read books about magic?

I don't know what my question is, I just though I should put my two cents in and see what you have to say.

Wow, lots of questions. I've got to prepare for an Apologetics's Conference today, so I'll try to answer tonight or by tomorrow or so.

Eh, for a non-christian, that is a good answer. haha

I'm going to reply, read it if you want, idc. I know this is debate but get over it, this will probably be my only real reply.

First off, God didn't create sin, Satan thought he was almighty and could do what he pleased, so he did. Hell was originally a place for Satan and his demons, but Satan is trying to get more people there than in heaven, so that when the world ends and the "great battle" begins, I guess is what it would be called, Satan will have more warriors and thinks that he will win. It's as simple as that, God doesn't send them there, Satan pulls them there.

I'm not the most intelligent person ever, nor do I know everything about this. But I think that when you ask too many questions about it, or get too deep into discussion, everyone just keeps going around in circles.
A lot of things with christianity is beyond our comprehension, IMO. And getting tied up trying to know it all is completely pointless. Like I said, you'll just keep going around in circles, because there is no way you can comprehend every little detail. It's just too great for our understanding.

The whole purpose for creating humans, imo, is for God to have one-on-one relationships with all of us. I really believe that is why we were created. Not just to serve him, but to love him and really know him. It's all about relationship.
Getting caught up in knowing it all, just takes away from 'relationship' aspect. I've seen it happen many times.

I just quit worrying about why this happens and why that happens. Because it just starts frustrating me after awhile. It's not that important anyway. On judgment day, if there is a judgment day, God isn't going to let you into heaven if you know it all. He is going to let you into heaven if you know Him.

I feel like I'm preaching here, and I'm really sorry. haha
I think I'm done, I had a bit more to say, but I lost it. Maybe I'll edit. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions directed towards me, cause like I said, I'm probably not going to reply here again. Tear me apart if you want, idc. This is my opinion. This is what I believe. So... there it is.

But if God knows all things and created all things then God did indeed create Lucifer with full knowledge of what Lucifer would do. If Lucifer created sin/hell then God indirectly created it because he knew that Lucifer would have created it. I think that God created sin and hell on purpose.

^ Like the role Iscariot played...

If God is a true and fair God:

Can Lucifer be forgiven?

Which is why I'm a deist.

But Lucifer isn't human, he's an angel. They're judged differently. As far as I know, God's mercy is only reserved for Humans. Soulless creatures can't enter into Heaven. I think Lucifer is a tool.

Justice!

TEAM AMERICA!

Before I go ahead and say anything more, I want to say something.

I realized that I as an apologetic and also an advocate for Christ have realized I was doing this all wrong. I'm taught through Scripture that through Jesus' wisdom and power I can overcome obstacles and problems that I face. I realize, though, I was trying to overcome this problem ( debating ) through just intellect. You see, the Good Word is what should be spread throughout the world.

But it's not just the Good Word. It's missing one key ingredient that can allow all of this to happen.

Love. I realize I haven't been loving you, ( yes, random people on the internet ) as my brothers and sisters in Christ. I can argue with you all I want, and even if I won debating you, what would it prove? That I'm some jackass who knows theology? That's it. I thought my thread here could dispel some of the misunderstandings and the questions that shrouded the big world of Christianity, but it wouldn't do anything unless I put in that main factor. The salt that lives the taste of food. The natural chemical reaction that brings about a change.

I will try again, except this time, with love and compassion. I hope to answer all of your questions with the little knowledge I know, and we'll be able to share and discuss many things together as family, not as foes.

I won't answer any questions tonight, but tomorrow I hope to answer more questions.

It's tomorrow

It depends on how you say it Podo. I Actually know the answers the questions I was asking you. I'm a Christian too. Althought, you're right. God is love, and that's the answer to all your questions. Look into it. It's pretty interesting. xD

Also, keep in mind, love is relative to the person you're speaking to. You will never love like God can love. Hell, you can try. That's what you're suppossed to do, but to truely love someone you have to know everything. What you're trying to do is very difficult. I like giving you a hard time. I feel like it will only make you grow.

You bastard!

WHat?! I wanted to see if he knew them. Do you want me to answer them? In a sense, I'm loving him the best way I know how.

I kid I kid :)

I know you were kidding don't worry. ;]

OK. I recently watched a documentary on the national Geographical chanel. Basically, Judas was the chosen one and they proved it or at least tried to. Oh, these were believers by the way.

Anyway, why is God so against premarital sex? What about Christians who don't want to get married? Why do they have to? WTF?

I have no questions. Just wanted to give a for your efforts.

This coming from a very non-Christian =)

hi fae

Hey Steven =)

how come the bible is so unoriginal? a good majority of these stories in there existed in earlier civilizations and date further back than the bible. u think maybe the bible ripped off some of their material?