QUOTE(sadolakced acid @ Jul 19 2006, 12:07 AM)
please respond to that.
anyways, i get the feeling you have no idea what it's like to raise a child, let alone as a single mother without a job.
is your school... moderately affluent? these girls who get pregnant, thier parents have jobs that pay alright?
i'm not trying to justify anything right now, so don't worry. i'm just questioning your reasoning.
iRock cB, you should be trying to woo people. it's the whole point of this forum. this isn't a place to just express your opinions and let others read them. we're not merely stating our opinions- if you had bothered to read over the first post, you would notice that.
you may do well to go back and read it now.
Sorry Acid, I forgot to respond to that. It was late, lol. I know, I wasn't able to find the source either but I know that article is posted around numerous web sites and news sites that don't have anything to do with abortion, so it's likely that the site didn't pull it out of the sky. I'd be happy to see if I can find the sources and put them up later.
Ok, I see what you mean with the antidepressants, but, again, what's that got to do with abortion? Give me parallels. I'm sorry if it's obvious to you, but I can't find the similarity.
Do you know what it's like to raise a child? If you don't, then why even ask that? It's quite hypocritical if you haven't. And I do have a younger sister that I have helped raise my whole life, in a sense. When my parents go to work, I had to look after her and I fed her, changed her, and woke up when she did most of the time because her room was right next to mine, lol. My sister, as I've said before, had her baby at 16 and she is a single mom and for a long while, had no job. Now my family is not rich at all
but we still did the best we could to raise him, and we still try our best even today. She lives in Florida now though. She got her GED, which is the exact same as getting a high school diploma, and she went to college. Now she's a dental assistant making great money. So no, I guess I don't know what raising a child all by myself is like, but I most certainly know a lot about it.
No, my school is far from affluent. It's one of the poorest schools in the county and state. My county is all farm lands. It's quite a poor county. :\ I think one of the girls, Lakiva, has parents with a pretty good pay, but I can't be positive. I never had a class with her, so I don't know her that well.
And don't worry, I'm not worried.
I did indeed read the first post and nowhere in that do I see where we're trying to "woo" people in the manner that forza suggested. Especially number 1. I don't think it's me you need to be telling to read the first post.
It clearly says Should abortion be illegal in the United States
, not Bulgaria. Oh, also number 3 for others.
QUOTE(Angelina Taylor @ Jul 19 2006, 11:01 AM)
I'm sorry, but there was no need for that. That's personal, and you shouldn't bring your emotions into a debate. I really don't care what you think about my "thinking skills".
And I don't care what you think about mine.
I just thought I'd say something nice, because you seem to be getting a little frustrated. Not saying you are, that's just how it appears.
I never said you didn't base my arguments on what I've said, but when I have already answered something and you go right back and say it again, that gets old fast and makes me think you're desperate to find an argument. Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you are, but that's just how it comes across.
I never said you were stupid.
Did you even comprehend what I said? Ok, let me ask the saaamme thing, again
. How can you KNOW that the baby will have a miserable life, as opposed to a wonderful life? It will get us nowhere. When I was younger. I had to wear the same clothes my older siblings wore and we drove around in a truck with half a floor board because it was rusted out and we lived in a house with rats and roaches that was given to us for free and my father was without a job for 3 years. My mother was in the hospital a lot because she had a brain tumor the size of a baseball. So yes, I have lived in poor conditions. Let's not turn this into a pity party, ok? I'm sorry you lived in poor conditions, I really am, but guess what? My mother had my baby sister during those times, and we made it just fine. Don't start throwing around excuses.
Let me ask you this - do you know how it feels to be pregnat? You're a guy, so I presume you don't. Also, do you know what adoption homes are like in Bulgaria? Or in other poor countries in Europe and elsewhere? I cannot describe it to you with words. It's 15-20 kids living in ONE room. With minimal conditions. Most of them never get educated. And most of them never get adopted. Because not many people look to adopt in such counries. Americans/Canadians have it easy.
Let me ask you this. Do YOU
know what it's like to be pregnan
t? Please, don't be hypocritical. It's one of the two things I hate in life. Hypocrisy and ignorance. And, darling, we're here to discuss abortion in America, ok? Not Bulgaria. I'm very sorry about your countries condition, but what does that have to do with anything? Considering that this debate is about abortion in America
, your statement is a personal one, so let's not bring our emotions into debate, ok?
Frankly, why are you in here? You don't even live in America. This topic is based on the question of should abortion be legalized in the United States
, therefore I don't see why you're in here if you do not live here. If you'd like to debate about abortion in general and give us reasons to pity your country, go elsewhere, thanks.
Nice research you did there. Sorry to dissapoint, but it is a part of the woman. You can't compare it to other examples, because how can you really compare a pregnat woman with a hospital? That's not logical to me. And identical twins have the same DNA, but one is not a part of the other. What's your argument there?
If the woman dies, the fetus will die probably within hours. So how can you use that as your argument really? It cannot survive on its own. Therefore, it's dependant on the woman. How can you even say that it will survive if the mother dies? We could also survive without food for a while, but we'd also die after. Right?
Considering I didn't do any research, I'll take that as a compliment.
I learned that in Biology AP after we had a two day discussion on abortion. And before you go saying that my teacher was pro-life, he wasn't. He's an atheist and pro-choice. So, you're pretty much calling my information false. Mind backing that up with some facts? If you can doubt my information that came right down from a trained professional who went to college to major in biology, surely I can doubt yours. So, go ahead, prove it. And actually, if you'd like to get scientific, identical twins have different phenotypes. That means the same DNA is expressed in different ways, therefore, it's not identical. To a DNA test, yes, but the genes in twins are different. If twins had the exact same DNA and genetic code, like parts of a body do, they would have the same set of finger prints. But, they don't. Wow, and I never thought biology/physical science class would come in handy!
I'd like you to read an article: Fetus Found Alive
. That baby was only 7 and a half months old in the womb. According to you, that would be fully dependant on it's mother. She is still alive today. It's actually been proven. This wasn't a freak event. If you're skeptical, look it up. I'm not wasting my time.
Ok, seriously, did you even read my entire post? What I bolded in your quote was the exact same thing I said, you're just trying to use it to attribute to your argument. And again, that looks like you're running out of things to argue.
Haha, in USA, you can sue pretty much everyone for pretty much everything. I'm not gonna argue for that.
Your statement is irrelevant, and you refuse to argue the point? Interesting...
You really wanna know? One of them didn't have money, or at least that's what she told me. The other two didn't know what they were getting into. Of course they regret it.. I've talked with them millions of times. One used to be my best friend when I lived there. You have NO idea whatsoever how hard it is to raise a baby on your OWN without a job, without a father in a shit-little town.
Yes, I really want to know, or I wouldn't have asked.
You're from Bulgaria, right? Yes, that's right. So, I'm assuming your friends live around there too, right? Yes, I can imagine the conditions for your friends are much worse then anything here in America, but guess what? We're dicussing the United States, so I must ask again, what's your point? Ok, do you have any idea how hard it is to raise a baby on YOUR own without a job, without a father, in a shit-little town? No, you only have friends who do. I on the other hand had a mother and a father who raised me AND my sister in that shitty place I described eairlier in a rural county in the middle of no where in North Carolina. Also, when my sister moved down to Florida to live with her mother (we have different mothers) she lived in the slums of Leto Florida in an apartment the size of my living room with drug dealers making deals right outside her complex. She still raised her son at 16 years old. She got her GED, which is the same as a high school deploma, like I said before, and she graduated from college and she's making great money now. Guess what? My nephew is just fine and we are thankful every day that she didn't have that abortion that the doctors pushed her and pushed her to have. Please, don't try and tell me that I have no idea. I have just as much of an idea as you, if not more. I was trying not to bring personal life into this, but you crossed that line first even when you said that we shouldn't bring personal thing into debate. For that, I'll have to call you a hypocrite.
Tell me it's ignorant when YOU get raped. Then we can talk.
Ok, you do the same when you carry a child. Then we'll talk about abortion.
I see what you're saying, but the comparisons you make are absurd. How can you compare a fetus with a dog? Or how can you give the example with your sister? It's not the same thing, dear.
Sure, adoption is the much better way to go, but as I said, abortion is an option too. I think I've said this, but if -I- got pregnat, I wouldn't be able to play/perform for at least the last 3-4 months, and that would literally ruin my career. I'm not saying it's the BEST way to go - no, it isn't. But it's an option and it's available.
Since you see what I'm saying, no matter how absurd, I guess the comparisons worked. Ah, perfect! I used the dog example just to see what you'd say. You said exactly what I thought you would. So, I compare a fetus to a dog, but you're the one who thinks it's ok to kill a fetus. In that case, you shouldn't mind me putting it on a same level as a dog, correct? You obviously don't think any higher of it. I'm sure you think killing a dog for no reason is wrong, don't you?
Well, I'm glad we agree on the adoption part. At least that's something.
So you'd rather end someones future life to better your own? That's selfish. And I very seriously doubt that 3-4 months would "ruin
" your career. I'm also in the music business, and I know what you mean. Stopping for 3-4 months wouldn't be a good idea, but it most certainly wouldn't ruin your career. You'd just have to start practicing again afterwards and you'd be back to normal in no time.
I always wanted to play piano but I never got lessons. I play guitar and sing. Singing is huge. If you don't practice for even a week, you'll get rusty real fast.
Hmm. Did you also know that some pregnat women who get raped also commit suicide? What's worse - ending one "life", or two?
You confuse me so much. Ok, the person just said, and I have already given an article, that suicide is more likely after abortion, and you reply to that with a "Did you also know that some pregnant women who get raped also commit suicide?" Where in the world is you're logic coming from? You're right, my statement about you thinking things through is uncalled for. It wasn't true. You're spinning around in circles. You said the same exact thing they said, but twisted it around to support your idea. According you your statement, if the woman gets raped and then has an abortion, that almost doubles her chances of committing suicide, wouldn't you say? You just enforced my argument even more. Thank you.
forza, I don't wear panties.
Most guys don't. You may want to look into that.
I have been here a lot longer then you have, so please don't try and explain anything about the rules or what people have already said. I've been saying this debate is pointless from the beginning. Had you actually read through the previous thread like the rules say, you would've realized that. That's rule #3, in red. I'm just arguing with Angelina Taylor because she actually has a good, valid argument.
And if you think that was a personal attack, you obviously haven't been here very long. You mentioned my name first and proceeded by saying I was bound to fail, so I replied. In no way did I "attack" you. I'm sorry if my reply embarrassed you a bit, but that's no reason to make outrageous claims.
Ahem, you cannot compare a fetus living off of the mother to us living off of say a respirator. Uhh we at least have the ability to live on our own, while a fetus has absolutely no chance. Invent a machine that can carry a two month old fetus around..then we'll talk. It is a part of the mother because it depends on the mother. Maybe not by definition of the word, but they are sharing the same food, air, water, and are connected. Now I don't know about you..but to me it seems like they're a part of one another.
Angelina Taylor already made that argument, so see my reply, read the article, and read the Debate Rules #3. It's written in red.